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There's been a couple of reports regarding people who supposedly caught it twice, but they are unconfirmed and there has been no study into it. It could be they had a false positive first time or the virus managed to linger in them for a while and resurfaced. I reckon if that was the case you'd be seeing that a lot where there have been major outbreaks. 

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8 hours ago, GazzaS said:

The message from mother nature is clear:  "It's taken a long time for me to come up with a better way...  but I'm coming for you!"

Nature will win. Remember: We need the Earth but it doesn't need us.

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On 7/22/2020 at 4:36 AM, BradG said:

It might, but if you're sick you should be at home. As I pointed out, if you're not sneezing or coughing etc, it's going to be difficult to transmit any virus. However, if I believe you and someone running can leave a 30 meter spread of this virus behind them floating in the air, then a mask isn't going to do me any good, a virus is small enough to pass right through it. So on one hand you argue that masks protect others, but then if you believe what you wrote about the virus being air borne, it makes wearing your mask virtually useless. Which is it?

Yes, people are dying, numbers sound scary, but I can do that too. On average, 2-3 thousand people world wide died per day of this virus. 7 thousand per day died in that time of other lower respiratory diseases, diarrheal diseases over 4 thousand per day (major killer of children under 5), 5 thousand per day died of neonatal disorders, 3500 per day of TD, 3 thousand of Aids. These are just the communicable reasons. 50,000 people will die to day due to cardiovascular issues, 30,000 from cancer...on and on and on.

You can have the disease without being sick. Studies indicate somewhere between 15%-40% of cases are asymptomatic. How are you supposed to stay home if you don't know you are ill with the virus?

Again, you don't need to cough or sneeze to pass the virus - just talking, shouting or singing, or leaving the virus on something you touch, like a door handle, will do the job. Logically, most people have caught the disease from somebody who is asymptomatic, because they'd not hang around somebody who was coughing or sneezing. Therefore it's not "difficult" to transmit the disease, otherwise we'd not have so many people infected.

The runner person leaves a 30ft trail, not 30m, and it's laboratory research that has proven it, I'm not making it up. Again, the mask is to protect others, not you.

Masks DO protect others. It's a fact. In my example, a runner wearing a mask leaves very little virus behind them.  The mask does little to protect the wearer. Hence wearing a mask is not "virtually useless", it is the primary reason China, Japan, et al have managed to keep cases so low. It also explains why EVERYBODY has to wear a mask in order to have the necessary effect, as proven in China, South Korea & Japan, amongst other.

Masks ensure that the disease remains in the person infected. THAT'S the key to controlling the spread. It works.

I'm not sure why you list daily deaths from various diseases? Does that somehow make the deaths from Coronavirus more acceptable, because more people are dying from other diseases? The key differences between those communicable diseases and the Coronavirus is that the latter is far, far more communicable, with an R of at least 2.5. There is no recognised treatment, the death rate is orders of magnitude higher than the other diseases. It's only been in existence less than a year, whilst the other diseases have had decades - let the Coronavirus run for decades and the numbers dying will be far, far higher. Cardiovascular issues are largely avoidable and controllable with diet & treatment, cancer deaths, as a percentage of 8 billion people, are tiny prorated to the Coronavirus.

Almost the entire medical establishment advocates widespread mask wearing in order to stop the disease. Experiments prove it works. China, S Korea, etc, proves it works. Are you saying that they are all wrong, and that you, with very limited experience, know better? 

 

 

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The issue is, here people running are not required to wear a mask. It's one of the exceptions. China didn't keep cases low, the Taiwanese were about the best prepared and closing their boarders fast is what stopped things progressing. Your last paragraph is just appeal to authority or consensus, not a real argument. The same people were telling us that masks weren't effective and could actually contribute to infecting people a month or two ago.

I am reminded though of this scene in Chernobyl; In any case it's a moot point, I wore mine when out today to avoid the fine.

y

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I just  don't want to wear a mask every where I go all the time from now on................ like they do in some other countries..... AND I DON'T like "Politicians" telling me what to do.................... they know the least of all of us....

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Well the mood in Australia has very quickly turned from one of "We're all in this together", to one of partisan Politics and saving one's own hide.

The Victorian Premier, after last week taking a cheap shot at the Federal Health minister, has now doubled down in the press by publicly stating that he wouldn't put his own mother in a Victorian Nursing Home at the moment. Aged Care homes in this country are overseen by the Federal Government, but in his State they're run by Victorians, and staffed by Victorians. Over 70 Victorian Aged Care facilities there are now rife with Covid-19, and stories are emerging of Patients being left without food or care for long periods of time, because the Staff there failed to take the necessary precautions in a time of Pandemic, with many of them infected now as well.

Australians generally have very good bullsh*t detectors. Standing at a lectern like a Deer in the headlights; and passing the buck on a situation you caused, while simultaneously throwing members of the Health community under the Bus is not going to end well. Nor is consigning vulnerable members of the community to a premature death, after twice refusing help from Federal authorities, when it was patently obvious that he had lost control of the situation a month ago.

Meanwhile, in Queensland this morning it turns out there's been infected person who works at a School, who contracted the virus after returning from a southern State. The School has been shut for deep cleaning, and I confidently predict the State border will be closed again by midnight tonight.

S

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As we look forward to getting through this COVID-19 2020 Pandemic, looking back on the history following
that 1918/19 Pandemic, I never realised just how it could have altered history is such a way. It seems now to have set up the seeds for a future aggressive Germany. (explained in the podcast below ) Plus, I never realises just how many of subcontinent India's pandemic victims there were, and all ignored by later reporting and history, that and how if affected Mahatma Gandhi actions.
That old 1918/19 Pandemic is still with us virally, but it seems our COVID-19 is a new beast.
 

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Well...  Covid is just down the road from me now...  I mean...  21 minutes drive from home, 11 minutes from work.  My wife's school has cancelled all excursions to the area around where I work.  Apparently my workplace has somebody who will sterilize the whole place in three days.  

It just got more real.  Being in that 50+ age group... 

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17 hours ago, GazzaS said:

Well...  Covid is just down the road from me now...  I mean...  21 minutes drive from home, 11 minutes from work.  My wife's school has cancelled all excursions to the area around where I work.  Apparently my workplace has somebody who will sterilize the whole place in three days.  

It just got more real.  Being in that 50+ age group... 

What happened? We, here in Canada have been hearing and seeing how well, OZ and NZ have done, at one point declared Covid free........ damn....

 

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The best thing would be to take off and nuke the planet from orbit.

Before humans figure out how to take the inherent despicability of the human race off the planet.

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9 hours ago, GazzaS said:

Well...  Covid is just down the road from me now...  I mean...  21 minutes drive from home, 11 minutes from work.  My wife's school has cancelled all excursions to the area around where I work.  Apparently my workplace has somebody who will sterilize the whole place in three days.  

It just got more real.  Being in that 50+ age group... 

Covid is often less than three feet from me. I have had several coworkers sent home after testing positive, and the clients on my unit are not right mentally so they aren't social distancing for shit. Three of my own clients tested positive but are pretty much asymptomatic. They try to give my TA hugs and me fist bumps but I don't let them touch me or get within arm's reach. Been working consistently around them and still not testing positive myself. Don't know how I've been so lucky. Good genetics, I guess.

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3 hours ago, Jeff said:

What happened? We, here in Canada have been hearing and seeing how well, OZ and NZ have done, at one point declared Covid free........ damn....

Both we and NZ have an inherent advantage; that being Island Nations, as well as factoring in the tyranny of distance.

New Zealand went hard lockdown straight away, and has eliminated the Virus there. Australia went into soft lockdown, relaxed that a little and now lets anyone in so long as they quarantine for a fortnight. That last point is the pertinent one. 

Take this example...

https://7news.com.au/news/sa/sa-unsure-about-arrival-of-infected-woman-c-1064522

A woman arrived in Melbourne from the UK, having been given a compassionate exemption to travel in order to visit a dying relative. She tested negative upon arrival, but was held for only a week by the Victorian authorities rather than the usual 14 days. She flew to South Australia, where she self-declared to authorities who apparently had not been advised. When tested there, she was Covid 19 positive, and put into quarantine. So she missed seeing the dying relative, and put everyone she met on the trip from Melbourne to Adelaide at risk.

If she hadn't done the right thing and self-declared, no-one would have been any the wiser. She would have gone about her business, visited whatever Medical facility the relative was staying at, possibly the funeral, and then gone home, exposing hundreds of people along the way. This has doubtless happened thousands of times in the last few months, and we might never know the true impact. People already living here in Au have had similar situations where their relatives have passed and not been able to see them or mourn their loss, we don't need to import others from Overseas to do so as well. Apparently, one in ten people who quarantined in Melbourne refused to submit to being tested before leaving isolation. 

S

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On 7/24/2020 at 5:17 AM, BradG said:

The issue is, here people running are not required to wear a mask. It's one of the exceptions. China didn't keep cases low, the Taiwanese were about the best prepared and closing their boarders fast is what stopped things progressing. Your last paragraph is just appeal to authority or consensus, not a real argument. The same people were telling us that masks weren't effective and could actually contribute to infecting people a month or two ago.

I am reminded though of this scene in Chernobyl; In any case it's a moot point, I wore mine when out today to avoid the fine.

y


It's not an appeal to authority or consensus, it's an appeal to science. The reason they all end up in consensus is that is where the science takes them, not because it's comfortable or because it is consensus, but because that's where the facts lead. When many people independently reach the same conclusions, that is powerful scientific evidence in itself.

Quote

'The same people were telling us that masks weren't effective and could actually contribute to infecting people a month or two ago'


 That is one hell of a sweeping statement! I've not read anywhere that masks 'contribute to infecting people'? Some of the early science was equivocal as to whether masks protected the wearer, whilst some experts advised against mask wearing because they didn't want millions of civilians draining the very limited mask supply from the people who needed them most, the medical practitioners. When the science proved that mask wearing reduces the spread of the virus from the mask-wearer to others, and masks supplies increased massively to allow both medical professionals and everybody else to access them, then the advice changed accordingly. That's how science works, decisions are made based upon the latest research results, and as those results change, so does the advice. Not changing advice with changing research is not science, it's dogma.

And, for what seems like the Nth time, masks work by protecting other people. Asymptomatic carriers are estimated to be responsible for up to 40% of covid-19 transmissions, and wearing masks ensures that they don't unwittingly infect other people. Look at that idiot Congressman from Texas today who tested positive for Covid-19. Up until this point he's refused to wear a mask because 'I don't have covid, but as soon as I test positive, you'll never see me without a mask'. Great strategy, except he's asymptomatic. He's been in Congress, meeting with other politicians and professionals, for a good few days, not always maintaining social distancing. Many are elderly. They are now getting tested as a matter of urgency, as are their contacts. Many have elderly relatives that they live with. They are scared. And all because one guy was too selfish to wear a simple face covering for a few hours a day. To make matters even worse, he only tested at all because he was due to travel with Trump in Air Force One, so had to be pre-tested. So he could have been transmitting the infection for days before then, and if he hadn't happened to be tested, he'd carry on spreading the virus amongst Congress for God knows how long.

Here in Texas, the virus seems to be being spread around by youngsters who consider themselves immune, plus older people who just don't seem convinced of the seriousness of the situation, at least right up until they fall ill, or cause a relative to fall ill and die. I find the whole thing so, so depressing, as it's so avoidable.

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15 hours ago, Jeff said:

 

What happened? We, here in Canada have been hearing and seeing how well, OZ and NZ have done, at one point declared Covid free........ damn....

 

There have recently been spikes in Sydney and Melbourne as people have failed to take the necessary precautions.  Unfortunately, two women from here went there, and brought it back.   Also...  unfortunately, those two women worked in a school which is minutes down the road from where I work.  It is a private school, but two of my co-workers have children enrolled there.  Those two people are now in isolation pending testing....   one of them actually came to work this morning.

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8 hours ago, GazzaS said:

There have recently been spikes in Sydney and Melbourne as people have failed to take the necessary precautions.  Unfortunately, two women from here went there, and brought it back.   Also...  unfortunately, those two women worked in a school which is minutes down the road from where I work.  It is a private school, but two of my co-workers have children enrolled there.  Those two people are now in isolation pending testing....   one of them actually came to work this morning.

I get folks are wanting to get out and get going again, I totally get that, but I guess we need to be a bit careful, and not forget we are in different times, and for now we should be a tad more aware, I find myself , I don't look at the arrows on the floors sometimes and go the wrong way, I try not to but, being the old dog I am trying to learn new tricks isn't easy :rolleyes:.  we are having a spike of sorts as I mentioned earlier, due to some group gatherings, I'm just hoping that maybe some of the folks in this world may go back to the old ways and consider others for a change, and maybe not be quite so selfish....and I'm sure we will get through this sooner or later, but for now, it can be a bit challenging and frustrating, and I am finding there are WAY too many 'experts' out there telling me what to do......

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13 hours ago, GazzaS said:

There have recently been spikes in Sydney and Melbourne as people have failed to take the necessary precautions.  Unfortunately, two women from here went there, and brought it back.   Also...  unfortunately, those two women worked in a school which is minutes down the road from where I work.  It is a private school, but two of my co-workers have children enrolled there.  Those two people are now in isolation pending testing....   one of them actually came to work this morning.

It's now 3 young Women, and they're right up to their necks in it.

https://mypolice.qld.gov.au/brisbanewest/2020/07/30/three-women-charged-under-the-public-health-act/

We are fortunate, in that the Authorities have gotten straight onto this and have acted swiftly. Free testing Centres had queues of between two and five hours yesterday depending on location, such was the demand by the community to find out if they had been exposed. You can still get a test done easily however at a local Pathologist by getting a referral from your GP. Nursing Homes have all been shut to visitors as a precaution. Only time will tell as to the full impact of these idiots' actions, but hopefully we can smother this without too much community spread.

We were issued a list by my Workplace on the possible places put at risk.

IMG_20200731_070325.thumb.jpg.44c20fc057865430b7066bca84237ad0.jpg

Any Employees who went there for any reason were to be isolated, apparently none of us delivered or otherwise went there. My Mother-in-Law was at the Springfield shopping centre on the day, but she's not too worried. She and my Wife were due to meet up there this weekend for coffee and a chat, I think that's still going ahead. Most if not all of these places listed will be closed for deep cleaning, and the Employees told to isolate for a fortnight... All due to the stupidity of a few.

S

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Ugh, now we are under curfew from 8pm to 5am and only allowed out once a day to shop for food and for 1 hour of exercise. You know these don't really effect me, by 8pm I'm usually logged in to play games, I'm never conscious at 5am, I shop for food once a week and I do weights at home. But something about being told there is a curfew makes me want to run down the street tackle out at 11pm screaming "suck on this coppers"...but anyways, no one needs to see that.

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1 hour ago, BradG said:

But something about being told there is a curfew makes me want to run down the street tackle out at 11pm screaming "suck on this coppers"...but anyways, no one needs to see that.

Well just remember, if you feel the need to do that Brad...

naked-man-facemask-240720.thumb.jpg.cada9ecbb34a4053e36ebc0569081221.jpg

Still wear your mask!

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Oh yeh, gotta remember my mask!

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Occasionally, you get one that smells a bit like sweaty crotch...

I think I know why now.

S

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Our friend who lives up the street went to the shops today and the super markets were stripped clean of meat. What's wrong with people? Lots of toilet paper, no problems there.

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1 hour ago, BradG said:

Our friend who lives up the street went to the shops today and the super markets were stripped clean of meat. What's wrong with people? Lots of toilet paper, no problems there.

Humans are a very strange animal  ............. very strange

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The meat industry is struggling and there is a danger of supply chain collapse. There have been warnings about this so I guess people are stocking up for it.

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My friends mate works in the chicken slaughterhouse and apparently they suspected some chooks were infected so they killed the lot.

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