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help needed from WW2 Luftwaffe colour experts


npb748r
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Hi all,

I bought the revell JU88 when it first came out and spent ages on my first ever PE set at the same time. That feels like it must have been 10 years ago or so ? Anyway, I lost the will to carry on after the interior was complete and it has sat on one of those shelves that we all have until a few weeks ago. This will be my first ever WW2 german build (excluding those done in my youth during the late 60's early 70's). I've just sprayed the upper surfaces with RML71 dark green and I think I was expecting something greener - the colour to my eyes seems to be more olive than I was expecting. The paint was vallejo 71.015 dark green.   I would appreciate any feedback, if the colour tone is correct then fine but if not I'd rather change it. Any feedback on the colour would be greatly received. 

Stay safe

neil

 

BBAB2D42-8F2C-4228-A2F5-944CA7B6ECBE.jpeg

A145832B-6F3B-43A3-A8C0-CC1447C439CE.jpeg

C2235773-B899-4498-8103-22E2D8C202DB.jpeg

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I've done dozens of WWII luftwaffe plane in 1/48 and 1/32 scale over the years and one of my unfortunate defects is A/C colors. I've used a few different brands of RLM colors for both fighters and bombers and IMHO the best match for Rlm 70/71 is the humbrol enamels. Even though I love the testors enamels they were off and didn't look right to my eye. I gotta say though I fought the humbrol paint tooth and nail but the end results were worth it, but you'll need to use humbrol thinner to airbrush them.

Most photos showed little contrast between the two colors even in black and white shots. Here is a shot with humbrol paint of my he-111h-6 and a good view of the upper surface of a real one.. HTH

he111_top

 

he111_1.jpg

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thanks The Dude - appreciate the pictures. I think once mine has been weathered a bit it will tone down nicely. I have just taken the masking off and it looks a lot better when looking at both colours. This is the first time I have used vallejo paints and the paint lifted in a couple of places when taking the tamiya masking tape off so will need to work out how to avoid that in future.  I have the 1/32 HE111 in my stash, your pictures make me think about doing that next !

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A consderation with multiple colors in  camo pattern paint work is how the colors 'work' together.

Case in point your discovery of the difference when you took off the masking.

Something I pondered over a few bowls when I did this work:

image.thumb.jpeg.e281effc50752d22baf9f9e55ebfb413.jpeg

I watched the blue change as I added each color. This is a normal adjustment your eye makes as it process' the color combo's.

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Your colour looks right to me.  Just beware that there are endless variations in any mass produced colour.

 

Regarding paint lift:  No primer is going to protect you from paint lift .  I have found that a light sanding everywhere you are going to mask can save you a lot of agony.

 

Looking forward to more and pics of your build.

 

Gaz

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1 hour ago, krow113 said:

Thank you that is my Fartbook page , one of a few I run.

All of the work done by me.

A wop rider like you may have seen the new MFH Duck kit. Worth a look.

Which Facebook pages do you run, Mate?

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8 hours ago, krow113 said:

apologies for jackin' the thread!

it's a conversation about modelling and bikes - that's all that matters, never a problem.  Thanks for the tip on the sanding, will give it a go. This is only my 2nd model using an airbrush, I've modelled for just 45 years the old fashion way - paintbrush or rattle can !

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They are  state of the art kits.

I have the Knuckle & the Brough and would get the Pan before a Duck....

I did start the Knuck , the frame , my favourite , having worked with the real item.

Here it is jigged up for a marathon soldering session:

image.thumb.jpeg.366e0cadcca04f37b957da01cda9ed74.jpeg

Part of my experience with these frames was installing them in a cage for straightening and then watching the straightening . Harley provides detailed drawings of the frames for that purpose and special checking tools are required as well. Some of the rods and tubes used on the model are patterned off the real tools.    So I got to know the frames well.

The soldering went well. MFH metal is softer than you would think but a clear series of events happens when you start to apply heat.

This frame was soldered together with an open flame torch:

image.thumb.jpeg.0fcc74b1ebb5658d95a7b86b3d7d6ab0.jpeg

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21 hours ago, npb748r said:

Hi all,

I bought the revell JU88 when it first came out and spent ages on my first ever PE set at the same time. That feels like it must have been 10 years ago or so ? Anyway, I lost the will to carry on after the interior was complete and it has sat on one of those shelves that we all have until a few weeks ago. This will be my first ever WW2 german build (excluding those done in my youth during the late 60's early 70's). I've just sprayed the upper surfaces with RML71 dark green and I think I was expecting something greener - the colour to my eyes seems to be more olive than I was expecting. The paint was vallejo 71.015 dark green.   I would appreciate any feedback, if the colour tone is correct then fine but if not I'd rather change it. Any feedback on the colour would be greatly received. 

Stay safe

neil

 

BBAB2D42-8F2C-4228-A2F5-944CA7B6ECBE.jpeg

A145832B-6F3B-43A3-A8C0-CC1447C439CE.jpeg

C2235773-B899-4498-8103-22E2D8C202DB.jpeg

This is one of the reasons I stopped using Vallejo, I think they got a lot of colors just wrong. You are correct, the dark green should be more green, and the black green should be almost black. There was an article someone wrote about a pilot in Germany in ww2 that had built some wooden models and used actual Luftwaffe paint on them, they were well preserved to this day and he compared them to what was available in model paint now, as I remember it, he came to the conclusion that early war colors and BoB were more green and quite dark. My personal belief is that MRP got the colors right, and Hataka is pretty close, and tamiya also has a few that are very close, but they are not labeled as RLM colors.

http://www.ipmsstockholm.org/magazine/2002/11/stuff_eng_profile_luftwaffe_bomber_camo.htm

 

I also remember that this picture seemed to be pretty close. 

FA41B379-50DE-4E64-9707-7E747E716807.jpeg

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Great pic!

This is a later war Heinkel.  I remember someone mentioning that later, they changed 70 and 71 due to fading problems.  For me, it's one of the hardest paint relations to get right.  But like I said....  there are endless variations.

 

 

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Yes, it looks like a green shift to that photo, but the Camo is basically right. The point of your choice of paints is to try to show contrast between the two RLM greens, that are close enough for your own tastes.

The RLM 71 changed noticeably over time, especially as the yellow component faded out of the solution... The colour left behind a lighter and more grey green. As shown on this Heinkel sitting with one of the Do 335 pre-production machine. The RLM 70 on the Dornier rear spinner giving a good comparison.

IMG_20201107_084806.jpg.5023ae333be98207b358cdf1743b707f.jpg

Your choice looks good to me, a little yellow for my tastes but should look fine once the RLM 70 is added.

S

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11 hours ago, Wumm said:

Your choice looks good to me, a little yellow for my tastes but should look fine once the RLM 70 is added.

thanks, it did make a difference once looked at with both colours on the model. I'm happy with it after all this great feedback.

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