GWH Hawk 81C AVG decals. 02/18/23

[Clunkmeister]

32 minutes ago, Peterpools said:

Ernie 

Terrific progress and I have to disagree - fit is good in most places but not all. But being a huge Tamiya fan boy and having built the P-40, way too much wasted details and not the equal of any of the new Tamiya kits for part fit and location. Part fit is sloppy in certain areas and even with GWH adding a correction sheet, they missed parts that needed to be relabeled/re-numbered. Unsure part location/orientation in the instructions surely didn't help. One area they do pull ahead of Tamiya is the quality of the decals but the decals have a few errors. 

Yeah, I’m nowhere near finished yet, so my opinions certainly don’t mean much yet.  But the willingness of Chinese manufacturers in general it give us these incredibly substandard instructions is beyond comprehension. Tamiya, Wingnut, ICM, IBG, Airfix, etc, gave given us clear, easy to understand instruction manuals. ZM’s are intentionally busy, but once you get past the technical info, they’re simple. Even Revell, who for years, had instructions scribbled by a toddler in Crayola, have improved remarkably.

The misnumbered parts just boggle my mind. 

[Peterpools]

Ernie

Right with you for sure

 

[GazzaS]

I'm just glad that we got a alternative to the Trumpeter trash.  Keep up the good work.

 

 

 

[Clunkmeister]

On 2/3/2023 at 2:56 PM, GazzaS said:

I'm just glad that we got a alternative to the Trumpeter trash.  Keep up the good work.

 

 

 

I owned that kit. For about 15 minutes.  I built the Craftworks kit years ago, and it was an accurate model, but certainly was a lot of work.

[CANicoll]

An amazing job there, Ernie at home or on the road.  Beautiful cockpit, by the way.  Definitely looking forward to the rest of the build. 

Which plane are you building, which markings?

[Clunkmeister]

We have the center section complete, and the fillets on the wing. Once the fillet joints set up, I’ll drop the wing in place. 
Preliminary fit looks great so far, although the wing will need to be clamped in place as it dries. 
 

 

[Clunkmeister]

The worst part so far has been the gun fairings.  They were “OK” but they sat slightly proud all around.

So I simply taped them in place one at a time before inserting the buns, and sanded the front and top down flush, being careful to avoid surface detail.

Then I inserted the guns and glued in the fairings. After it all sets up, I’ll attack the bottoms. 
Not a huge deal, all in all, it took me bout 10 minutes to clean them up.  DON’T try to do it after the guns are in place. 

[CANicoll]

Looking really good, Ernie!  Are those the kit barrels or did you substitute them?  CN

[Clunkmeister]

42 minutes ago, CANicoll said:

An amazing job there, Ernie at home or on the road.  Beautiful cockpit, by the way.  Definitely looking forward to the rest of the build. 

Which plane are you building, which markings?

Thanks!  I really want to build one from each Squadron, but I think I’ll start with something from 3 Sqn, Hells Angels, I believe. Chuck Older is an obvious choice, but there is also one on the Eagle Editions sheet, Bill Reed’s ride, that still has the RAF roundels in place on the top wing.  Tommy Haywood’s ride is cool as well, with the unfinished shark mouth.  It seems no two birds were the same. 
One thing I’ve been contemplating, is that since the RAF roundels were painted over in theatre, wouldn’t the paint used there be a slightly different tone?  
Maybe even adding the RAF roundels, then painting over, allowing some to show vaguely through? For all that the AVG was documented and memorialized, there is precious little to show of its early days. 
Also, as to the Disney “flying tiger” decal.  Wasn’t it varnished in place?  Most decal sheets seem to show a black background, but I’ve also heard said that it wasn’t black, just a discoloration due to the clear varnish application affecting the film differently.

Thoughts?

[Clunkmeister]

2 minutes ago, CANicoll said:

Looking really good, Ernie!  Are those the kit barrels or did you substitute them?  CN

Thanks Chris.  Those are the kit barrels. I’m positively blowing through this one. Strictly OOB with no hanky pinky or game playing. 
I doctored up the kit barrels a bit, and they look fabulous. BUT, it’s a really crappy time to be adding gun barrels. 😡

Attrition may mean Master barrels, yet. 😂

[Clunkmeister]

Later, for 1st Pursuit, I’ll so Dick Rossi’s

and for 2nd Pursuit, Tex Hill, of course.  I met the man, and almost worshiped the ground he walked on.

3rd Pursuit this build, though.  Most likely Chuck Older

[Clunkmeister]

So far, the fit has been phenomenal. Better than Tamiya, as far as I can see. 

[Clunkmeister]

Clamping power!

[GazzaS]

3 hours ago, Clunkmeister said:

I owned that kit. For about 15 minutes.  I built the Craftworks kit years ago, and it was an accurate model, but certainly was a lot of work.

I sold mine for the cost of postage to Western Australia.  Never even heard of Craftworks.

[Clunkmeister]

8 minutes ago, GazzaS said:

I sold mine for the cost of postage to Western Australia.  Never even heard of Craftworks.

It was a short lived 1/32 resin kitmaker here in the 80s.  They did a nice P-40C. Had a lot of white metal castings…

I’m NOT a P-40 fan, although I should be. It was like the Hurricane; used and produced from start to finish of the war, and like several pilots said, was quite competent, and quite deadly with a skilled pilot, but always left you wishing you had a little bit more airplane to fight with.

The Russians sure didn’t care for them, much preferring the P-39 for their style of fighting. 

[GazzaS]

1 hour ago, Clunkmeister said:

It was a short lived 1/32 resin kitmaker here in the 80s.  They did a nice P-40C. Had a lot of white metal castings…

I’m NOT a P-40 fan, although I should be. It was like the Hurricane; used and produced from start to finish of the war, and like several pilots said, was quite competent, and quite deadly with a skilled pilot, but always left you wishing you had a little bit more airplane to fight with.

The Russians sure didn’t care for them, much preferring the P-39 for their style of fighting. 

Love the B and C...   don't care much for the rest of them.  When they cut down the rear fuselage, it didn't look as good.  P-39 is a nice looking plane, too.  Too bad I hear nothing but bad about the 1/32 offering.

[Peterpools]

Ernie

Nice progress but I'm still on the opposite side of the fence about the kit as you. I didn't think part fit was all that great and never needed clamps on any Tamiya kit I've built.  Gun fairings were as bad on mine. Nose fit issues were mine alone and needed a lot od work to fix.

I know paint and color has always been a hot topic on the AVG's P-40 and isn't as clear cut as it seems. I did a lot of research when I built mine and none of the actual RAF Day Colors were available to Curtiss and they contracted with DuPont for the paint - the colors are different. I'm sure it doesn't make that much of a difference as the paint faded and was worn over time. Maybe my research can help a bit in the actual model paint selection.  

 

[CANicoll]

Ernie, You named my three favorite AVG pilots - all three signed my Tiger Fire print, and we share a mutual admiration of Tex Hill.  My former wife sent my copy of his Biography to him and he signed it and returned it.  A great birthday present!  I missed seeing him when he came to DC and I still regret that.

Love your build and I'll have to remember those clamps for the future.  We have a ton in the woodshop and they are definitely stronger than what I have.  I also like the P-40 but guess I have not found a kit that says to me "Build me!"  I followed Peter's build and those problems put me off a bit.  That is a lot of money to have to fight the build.  Maybe your build will change my mind.

Really interested in the colors you choose.  They faded so much, like Peter said, it almost doesn't really matter what you start with.  The wear and tear these aircraft endured is really something.  A testament to the ground crews keeping them flying.  You know, I've never seen an AVG modeled with any patches from gunfire. Hmmm

For the P-39, I didn't mind the SH kit too much.  Mine was free - it was a giveaway at the Phoenix Nationals (I wandered in during vendor setup to take some pictures and it was sitting on a table, with a sign that said 'FREE' on it).  It is a simpler kit than the KH kit, but it was an OK build. The KH kit for me was an unmitigated disaster.  Not a single panel on the plane fit properly closed. The KH folks came to our local show/competition and when I asked them about the fit problems I received a snotty response "well, that was an early kit".

I've built a number of the Eduard 1/48 P-39/P-400 kits (they have reissued the P-400!) and really like the engineering and quality.  They build up nicely.

 

[Clunkmeister]

Chris, I used the clamps simply to keep the wing snugged up as far as it would go while the glue dried after I walked away for a bit.  That fit seems to be critical and I want to see if I can avoid  the issue Peter had with the nose fit. 
Peter says it was a mistake earlier in his build that caused it, and hopefully through blind luck I can avoid a similar fate. 
 

Descriptions of the paint fade from people who were there makes me want to try taking Peter’s mix, and then lightening it slightly followed by some weathering. The accounts back then said that the brown quickly faded to a sand tone and the green faded to spinach. As in British Sand and Spinach.  Then use the faded Chinese roundels. 
You and Peter are 100% correct in that most people build clean AVG Tomahawks, while in practice, they’d be all beat up.

[Clunkmeister]

I hope th nose fits well, as I certainly don’t want to lose the nose Gun access panels hinge detail.  That’s a prominent feature of there Tomahawks. 

[Clunkmeister]

One thing I will say about this kit is that I absolutely love the plastic used.  It reminds me of WNW plastic, which was the best plastic I’ve ever experienced in kits.

It bonds well, is soft without being greasy, and is flexible enough to be bent without disastrous results.  I wonder if this Company didn’t do some of Wingnuts molding?

This plastic is the exact opposite of Hasegawa’s hard as a rock plastic. 

[Peterpools]

Ernie

I had to re-scribe mine as I lost them with my fit issue. I'm sure the bulk of the nose fit issues were my doing, as the fit of the firewall is critical. In the end, I'm happy with my AVG Flying Tiger. Still feel the biggest drawback to the kit for me, was all the time and effort I put into building, painting and weathering all the internal details, of which almost none can be seen through the small hatch, which I think is a radio access hatch. Same for the fuel lines, if you don't make the lower fuselage 'wing hump' part removable.  I'm just not big on: I know it's all there and have photographs if I ever want to look - I never do. 

 

[Clunkmeister]

1 hour ago, Peterpools said:

Ernie

Nice progress but I'm still on the opposite side of the fence about the kit as you. I didn't think part fit was all that great and never needed clamps on any Tamiya kit I've built.  Gun fairings were as bad on mine. Nose fit issues were mine alone and needed a lot od work to fix.

I know paint and color has always been a hot topic on the AVG's P-40 and isn't as clear cut as it seems. I did a lot of research when I built mine and none of the actual RAF Day Colors were available to Curtiss and they contracted with DuPont for the paint - the colors are different. I'm sure it doesn't make that much of a difference as the paint faded and was worn over time. Maybe my research can help a bit in the actual model paint selection.  

 

Peter, I’m following your build thread closely for mine. I read what you wrote on colors, and it makes sense. Your research on it all seems to be exactly how I’d interpret it as well.

An interesting point is that Jerry Crandall at Eagle Editions also stated that the blue on the topside Chinese roundels faded very quickly in the harsh Chinese climate, but the lower ones stayed relatively clean and fresh. So yes, faded on top, but fresh underneath.  But then you ask yourself:  “Self, why aren’t the fuselage roundels following suit”?  They’re in the sun as well….

[Clunkmeister]

6 hours ago, Peterpools said:

Ernie

I had to re-scribe mine as I lost them with my fit issue. I'm sure the bulk of the nose fit issues were my doing, as the fit of the firewall is critical. In the end, I'm happy with my AVG Flying Tiger. Still feel the biggest drawback to the kit for me, was all the time and effort I put into building, painting and weathering all the internal details, of which almost none can be seen through the small hatch, which I think is a radio access hatch. Same for the fuel lines, if you don't make the lower fuselage 'wing hump' part removable.  I'm just not big on: I know it's all there and have photographs if I ever want to look - I never do. 

 

And your post on that during your build is why I left literally ALL of that junk out of my build.  I am, by nature, a lazy SOB, so why go through all that effort for naught?  Over engineered for sure.  The elevator hinges made me chuckle a bit. PE? Really?  That is an accident waiting to happen. Reminds me of Tamiya’s efforts to hinge everything on their 1/32 builds. If left to their own devices, made for an airplane that looked like the controls were unhooked. They finally wised up on their Corsair.  

[Peterpools]

Ernie

Excellent point. Just think GWH got it wrong plus the sizes of the roundels are incorrect and not consistent with the kit's instructions and placement color marking/painting guides, if I remember correctly. What I should have done is go the route you are and have used Eagle Editions decals - big mistake on my part.