Very interesting Youtube video on "model-markings and cancel culture"

[Fidd88]

I've been out of the kit-building hobby for 40 years, and these days am a scratch-building models. Nevertheless I was very interested in the video below which addresses the way "cancel culture" (or self-censorship to avoid it) is starting to affect the hobby. For now I'll reserve my own opinion on this, but as you may imagine it is not in favour of "cancel-culture"!

 

[HubertB]

Interesting …

I have my own type of « cancel culture »: don’t go on social media at all (well, actually, a modelling forum IS a type of social media, so I am contradicting myself here  ).

As far as Instagram, Tweeter, Facebook, Tiktok and the like are concerned, I am sticking to my choice of not going there, at all. I find these sites truly horrible : they will behave the way the video describes it, yet will tolerate the most horrible speeches from individuals, whether they are corrupt, rotten politicians or ordinary bullies, all in the name of « free speech ». They encourage stupidity, unstructured thinking, conspiracy theories, outrageous behaviours, gratuitous meanness, agressive comments, etc., behaving like the worst capitalists - as decried by Marx and other Nineteenth and Twentieth Centuries thinkers - by cynically trying to maximise their profits from the people participating there, whether it is by selling personal data, or letting algorithms nurture one stream of thinking for an individual, all to generate more consultations, more audience, and therefore more advertising revenues… I see no point exposing my life, posting a pic of my plate, my clothes, my make-up or whatever else, for others to « like » or comment on…or worse, be thus tagged an « influencer » , and paid to fill these social media with more of my BS …

Ok. End of the old-fart rant  …

In spite of all the above, as I said above, I am contradicting myself by posting here, and watching and reacting to others’ posts. But, and I think the history could show a number of examples, as soon as a modelling forum becomes a for-profit operation, it soon dwindles as passion considerations take second place to business goals … At least, this is what I saw many times …

As far as the heart of the video is concerned (« Do I show a swastika on a model ? ») I have views you could dub contradicting :

1) if it was on the original I am representing, and knowing a model is a 3D illustration of a piece of technology at a given time in history, IMHO at least, then it should be here …

2) if it as allowed to show my model with the swastika, for a wider audience to see, then I see no reason for hiding it. But, on the other hand, it is forbidden to expose a Nazi swastika in Germany. If I lived in Germany, and was posting pics for a mostly German audience, I’d abide by the law, full stop. Of course, it’s becoming grey when a site has a worldwide audience, including Germany … But , that a « social media » censors such a picture is just a sign of the crass stupidity, hypocrisy, and lack of historical culture of these businesses, who will in the same time tolerate other posts which are in every aspect displaying opinions which would have had their place in the Nazi propaganda pamphlets …

3) I have personally felt a certain (read « strong ») uneasiness with the fascination of the Nazi war machine by many modellers. Yes, I acknowledge that they put the best of the German engineering culture to developing these equipments, and some are fascinating from this engineering point of view, but I am still personally uneasy with this drive to privilege the Nazi machines in some modellers’ stashes …

4) I will however not criticise anyone building models of Nazi machines, on the assumption that modelling a Nazi machine does not make you a Nazi, and will most often follow - and learn from - the building threads of such, but I have made a conscious decision to NEVER build a Nazi machine with Nazi symbols. Mind you, I apply the same conscience rule to the equipments of that other political monstrosity of the 20th Century, namely the Soviet Union.

Hubert

 

 

[Martinnfb]

Interesting discussion here.

 

[GazzaS]

I see a huge difference between building a model vice professing or promoting an ideology or political belief system.

 

Some rules are ridiculous.  F@ck the cancel culture.

[nmayhew]

i try to ignore it for the most part but when someone tries to tell me I need to look in the mirror because I'm building a 109 or a Das Reich Tiger rather than a P-47 or a Sherman they can f*ck off

I am comfortable with my choices and feel no need to virtue signal my anti-Nazi credentials. If we do actually get into all that, I'm happy to tell them how my Grandfather was 7RTR Churchill driver in Normandy, one Great Uncle served on MTBs in Royal Navy, the other in Matilda tanks in North Africa; that I have been to Normandy with a coach load of veterans - back in 04 - to pay my respects etc etc etc.

the parallels with another recent movement whose motto related to certain lives and their importance is interesting - in both cases there is absolute zero room for any other view, or any sensible discussion; it's one view or you're a racist.

I think that's all I better say!

[Fidd88]

Some very sensible replies there I think. I especially agreed with HubertB. There's another "politically-correct" wokism I've noticed of late, that runs in tandem with sensitivity to aircraft markings in both RC modelling and plastic-modelling. This one concerns the makers of documentary films concerning WWII and the Third Reich. This involves referring to "Nazi tanks" or "Nazi aircraft" or "Nazi ships", rather than "German" ones. This is troubling on two scores, for a start the Kriegsmarine and to a lesser degree the Luftwaffe and Wehrmacht, were not infrequently luke-warm towards Nazism. Secondly, of course, if we're to learn anything from history, is that perfectly ordinary, non-Nazi Germans were capable of committing atrocities and did so with little or no push-back towards the authority requiring them to do so. Calling them "Nazi" or "Nazi German" creates the impression that it was only enthusiasts for the party who did so. Extensive recordings of German POW's at Trent Park (and other places) proves the reverse. The only reason these did not result in war-crimes trials was that getting Germany back on it's feet was considered more important in '45.

It's noticeable how there's a generational change at work here. My father, who served in the wartime RAF, invariably referred to them collectively as "Jerry" or "Germans" (always pre-fixed by "bloody"!), my generation likewise, although we dropped the "bloody" on occasion, but the millenials now make this distinction of referring to "wartime Germans" as "Nazi Germans", and never ever just "Germans". Interesting no? Such are the nuances of history corrupted by the pc brigade to the point where we fail to learn from it - and have to repeat it, as the saying goes. IMHO of course.

[HubertB]

I think the issue is more nuanced than just tagging it with « political correctness ». Words have a meaning, and it is not a bad fact that historical hindsight brings nuances in words used to describe an historical period.

Factually, you had a country, Germany, a people living in this country, Germans, and finally a political regime, the Nazi regime, that was responsible for not only a global war, but also unforgivable atrocities. And it is undeniable that the vast majority of the German people of the time put in place, then supported the regime, whether enthusiastically, actively, passively, out of interest, selfish indifference or cowardice …

In the aftermath of WWII, emotions were - understandably - strong, and it was commonly accepted to equate the country, the people and the regime, adding a derogatory nickname for a good measure. It was « bloody Jerrys » in the UK, and I was raised - in the early sixties - hearing of « Boches » in France. As the people who lived these emotions disappear, then the analysis brings the nuances in the wording. There is still a country and nation, Germany, a people, Germans, but thank God the political regime is not there anymore. Which is why it induces a distorted perception to use the word « Germans » to describe in a short-cut the people of the time, whilst the same word also applies to today’s people, who are not at all the same. IMHO, the only apt wording today for this historical period is « Nazi regime », but I am the first to « simplify » it by using « Nazi ». Not political correctness, but factual historical analysis.

Which does not detract from your comment that a lot of Germans of the time, whilst not active supporters of the regime, or members of the Nazi party, did commit the atrocities their regime ordered them to do, without too much of a conscience objection. This is an attitude still common today, everywhere, and you unfortunately see a lot of people willing to support political lines, and even bring them to power, that are not so distant from the early days and slogans of the Nazi regime, even in countries which are considered old - or even beacons of - democracies. Which is why it is important to use precise words : you see Nazi behaviours in many countries - and  not only Poutine’s Russia, btw - and describing these as such is - hopefully - the first step of raising a collective conscience.

I think the best post in this thread was Martin’s : it shows how political correctness is the lazy way out of a real introspection and reflexion about personal choices. And why the so-called « social media » can nurture and make flourish this laziness, and encourage and reward the worst traits of human behaviours and the worst individuals.

Hubert

[Fidd88]

Hubert, that's a superb post, thank-you so much for taking the time to post it. Evidently I do not agree completely with your view, but I do very largely so. I also agree with you and Martin concerning social-media, which I too eschew for the reasons raised.