Peterpools Posted November 14, 2022 Share Posted November 14, 2022 John Just catching up and as always, your progress is amazing. Holy smokes, hard to believe the primer peeled like that. I've pretty much settled on either Mr Color or Tamiya Lacquers gloss black for my NMF bases color and so far, no issues but I just know, there is always a surprise waiting around the corner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnB Posted November 14, 2022 Author Share Posted November 14, 2022 I did some work on feathering out the bad spots then hit it with some flat white. When that was dry I sprayed some Alclad aluminum. It was looking okay but I decided I better do some "testing" on the whole model "just in case". Here are the results. SOD for this one. Enough is enough. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnB Posted November 14, 2022 Author Share Posted November 14, 2022 48 minutes ago, BlrwestSiR said: That happened to me too but only on the tail. I was able to feather it out and not have to do a full re-paint thankfully. You got lucky Carl. I was hoping I had this one sorted out but not so.🤪 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnB Posted November 14, 2022 Author Share Posted November 14, 2022 48 minutes ago, Peterpools said: John Just catching up and as always, your progress is amazing. Holy smokes, hard to believe the primer peeled like that. I've pretty much settled on either Mr Color or Tamiya Lacquers gloss black for my NMF bases color and so far, no issues but I just know, there is always a surprise waiting around the corner. It was going along pretty well for a while but now it's a dead duck. Too bad as I was hoping it would be a really good looking NMF model. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peterpools Posted November 14, 2022 Share Posted November 14, 2022 John OMG, What happened but more importantly why? Just sorry to see the 104 parked on the SOD. I've been there more then I care to remember and always wind up stripping the paint off nose to tail. Sometimes, the SOD is the best option and move on. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnB Posted November 14, 2022 Author Share Posted November 14, 2022 4 minutes ago, Peterpools said: John OMG, What happened but more importantly why? Just sorry to see the 104 parked on the SOD. I've been there more then I care to remember and always wind up stripping the paint off nose to tail. Sometimes, the SOD is the best option and move on. I think the problem was the Alclad primer. Apparently it just did not "meld" to the plastic. I hate to SOD it but it's just too much aggravation for me to contend with right now. I'll probably resume work on it later on but for now it's gonna stay on the SOD. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peterpools Posted November 14, 2022 Share Posted November 14, 2022 Got ya 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GazzaS Posted November 14, 2022 Share Posted November 14, 2022 So sad, John. Question: Did you sand the whole plane just a little before you painted? I find that really prevents paint lift when masking occurs. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnB Posted November 14, 2022 Author Share Posted November 14, 2022 6 minutes ago, GazzaS said: So sad, John. Question: Did you sand the whole plane just a little before you painted? I find that really prevents paint lift when masking occurs. No I did not Gaz. I don't think I've ever done that. Whenever I decide to resume the build I think I'll rub it down with some Alclad airbrush cleaner. THAT will remove all the old paint and primer right down to the plastic. It will also slightly craze the plastic which should give any future paint something to hold on to. If it screws up the model then so be it. I'll remove the AMS cockpit and probably use it for another build. I wanted a "C" in the 1st place but couldn't find one. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GazzaS Posted November 14, 2022 Share Posted November 14, 2022 4 minutes ago, JohnB said: I wanted a "C" in the 1st place but couldn't find one. You can't find the Italeri A/C? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnB Posted November 14, 2022 Author Share Posted November 14, 2022 31 minutes ago, GazzaS said: You can't find the Italeri A/C? Yes but I don't want to fork out $150.00 for one. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GazzaS Posted November 14, 2022 Share Posted November 14, 2022 25 minutes ago, JohnB said: Yes but I don't want to fork out $150.00 for one. I'm afraid that the days of cheap models are over. Even at it's earliest days the kit was selling for 90$. But patience may reward you, some day. I remember partaking in the auction of a deceased modellers stash. I thought I would get the 2 or 3 I wanted at a great price. Yet... everything went over retail. I came away empty handed. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlrwestSiR Posted November 14, 2022 Share Posted November 14, 2022 The Italeri 104 kit prices are all over the map for some reason. The best deals I've seen on them have been from Lucky Model but you have to be willing to wait a while for it to arrive via surface mail. Any other shipping option out of Hong Kong is atrocious. John, sorry to see the paint issues. They're definitely worse than what I experienced. I used Xtreme Metal black primer under the Alclad and that worked out ok. Polished Aluminium will lift a bit no matter what though but not like what happened in your case. Carl 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnB Posted November 14, 2022 Author Share Posted November 14, 2022 44 minutes ago, GazzaS said: I'm afraid that the days of cheap models are over. Even at it's earliest days the kit was selling for 90$. But patience may reward you, some day. I remember partaking in the auction of a deceased modellers stash. I thought I would get the 2 or 3 I wanted at a great price. Yet... everything went over retail. I came away empty handed. Wow! Never thought that would happen. Ya just never know. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnB Posted November 14, 2022 Author Share Posted November 14, 2022 38 minutes ago, BlrwestSiR said: The Italeri 104 kit prices are all over the map for some reason. The best deals I've seen on them have been from Lucky Model but you have to be willing to wait a while for it to arrive via surface mail. Any other shipping option out of Hong Kong is atrocious. John, sorry to see the paint issues. They're definitely worse than what I experienced. I used Xtreme Metal black primer under the Alclad and that worked out ok. Polished Aluminium will lift a bit no matter what though but not like what happened in your case. Carl I've decided to pull that mother off the SOD and try to save it. We will see! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnB Posted November 14, 2022 Author Share Posted November 14, 2022 I decided to try to save this build. I dampened some cotton balls with Alclad airbrush cleaner and swabbed it down. That removed nearly all the primer and paint. Now I'll re-prime with trusted Testor's Flat White then shoot some Alclad aluminum on it. Then I'll test to be sure the Alclad stays put. We'll see. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peterpools Posted November 15, 2022 Share Posted November 15, 2022 John Glad to see you're giving the 104 a second go. Take it from a paint stripping expert with way too much experience: I always strip paint off a model with Mr Color Self leveling Thinner and then follow up with 70% Isopropanol alcohol as a final cleaner. Works like a charm. Primer for me is either MRP Light Gray Primers or Mr Surfacer - both have been full proof so far. The only masking I've done on NMF's is with Tamiya tape and so far, Lady Luck has been with me, as I can't remember any paint lifting at all. My gloss black base coat is either Mr Color or Tamiya Lacquer, both dry rock hard and glue themselves to the primer. Is the Testor's Flat White paint or a primer? I've always assumed primer actually eats into the plastic finish and acts as a nice base for the paint to adhere t, while paint doesn't eat that well into the plastic. Fingers crossed all goes according to plan. 🤞🤞🤞 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnB Posted November 15, 2022 Author Share Posted November 15, 2022 2 hours ago, Peterpools said: John Glad to see you're giving the 104 a second go. Take it from a paint stripping expert with way too much experience: I always strip paint off a model with Mr Color Self leveling Thinner and then follow up with 70% Isopropanol alcohol as a final cleaner. Works like a charm. Primer for me is either MRP Light Gray Primers or Mr Surfacer - both have been full proof so far. The only masking I've done on NMF's is with Tamiya tape and so far, Lady Luck has been with me, as I can't remember any paint lifting at all. My gloss black base coat is either Mr Color or Tamiya Lacquer, both dry rock hard and glue themselves to the primer. Is the Testor's Flat White paint or a primer? I've always assumed primer actually eats into the plastic finish and acts as a nice base for the paint to adhere t, while paint doesn't eat that well into the plastic. Fingers crossed all goes according to plan. 🤞🤞🤞 I decided to use Testor's gloss white as a base coat/primer. I THINK it will work okay but we'll see when I shoot some Alclad aluminum on and mask over that. I too use Tamiya masking tape as my main go to for masking. Fingers crossed! 🙄 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnB Posted November 15, 2022 Author Share Posted November 15, 2022 Over sprayed with gloss white. Now I'll set it aside for the day to let it dry. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peterpools Posted November 15, 2022 Share Posted November 15, 2022 🤞 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnB Posted November 15, 2022 Author Share Posted November 15, 2022 Something I'm going to do is spray paint some clear decal paper with colors other than metal shades. There are some panels on the a/c that are a light tan color and panels on either side of the vertical tail that are a very light gray. My plan is to go on and paint all the metal colors such as aluminum, etc and then measure out and apply the painted decals in their appropriate places. Should minimize chances for "problems". We will see! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlrwestSiR Posted November 15, 2022 Share Posted November 15, 2022 Canuck decals did some of those panels as decals so not a bad idea. For the tail ones, maybe paint the grey panel first, mask over it and then do the NMF? I did that on mine and it worked out. Carl 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peterpools Posted November 15, 2022 Share Posted November 15, 2022 John Pretty cool idea. Carl certainly has a workable alternative with less changes of peeling paint. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnB Posted November 15, 2022 Author Share Posted November 15, 2022 1 hour ago, BlrwestSiR said: Canuck decals did some of those panels as decals so not a bad idea. For the tail ones, maybe paint the grey panel first, mask over it and then do the NMF? I did that on mine and it worked out. Carl That would be the best way for sure but I think painting the whole a/c then adding the panel decals minimizes the chance for paint peel although I'll still have to paint the different color metal panels and hope for no peel off. 🙃 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnB Posted November 16, 2022 Author Share Posted November 16, 2022 Overall Alclad aluminum applied. Next up is painting some panels various shades. Fingers crossed for no pull off! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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