CANicoll Posted May 27 Author Share Posted May 27 7 hours ago, BlrwestSiR said: Chris, the exhaust tubes can sit free. The fit is just snug enough that you don't need to glue them in place if you put them in last. Don't worry about the mounting tab between the burner cans. The only AM company that used the same setup was Aires and theirs were undersized so would fall out if you didn't. Your post reminded me that you might need to check the clearance on the inside of the wing at the back where the burner cans go in. Putting the burner cans in afterwards means you'll have an easier time getting the wing/fuselage seams dealt with. OMG. OK, I just figured out (from what you said) that if I attach the tubes to the burner cans the entire assembly can slip in afterwards. Doh!!!! THIS is exactly why I appreciate your comments and suggestions so much. And I am EXACTLY at this point so your advice is incredibly timely - thank you! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CANicoll Posted May 27 Author Share Posted May 27 Made some progress test fitting the wings to the fuselage. The cool thing about the Tamiya set up is they use screws to hold the wing bottom to the fuselage and the wing top to the wing bottom. Looks like there will be a little bit of a seam to deal with on both sides of the fuselage, but nothing extreme. Also the two scoops on the side of the nose needed some filler but may still need a bit more blending. Right side: Left side: From the top: Added the two scoops on the sides of the nose. These will be painted the camo color in the final scheme. Taped up and ready for the primer coat and underside color. 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peterpools Posted May 27 Share Posted May 27 Chris You're on a roll and all the various sub-assemblies and small parts are coming together nicely. Carl's help and suggestions are both timely and a big help. Nothing like receiving top notch help and advice. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CANicoll Posted June 1 Author Share Posted June 1 Finally getting to the painting stage at last. Taking a look at both the Top Notch Camo Mask instructions and the Zotz decal instructions I think I may have a minor problem to address: The Masks look to be for a short-nosed Phantom II, while the decals show a long-nose Phantom. Hmmm. I have not opened up the mask sheet to look at the pieces. Should not be a big problem to extend the nose masks if necessary. Here is the full sheet: Camo Painting has started! Sprayed the brown on the areas indicated. This paint work is pretty typical of the 'white-basing' I do when I'm attempting to replicate faded paint work. More on this later. On each side of the fuselage the splitter supports will need to be thinned down. Compared to pictures I've seen; these are way over scale. Time to grab a sanding stick... Close-up of the nose: To Fade or not to Fade, that is the question... HOWEVER, found a few more pictures on this amazing resource called the Internet. Neither plane looks to have very faded paint. I'm starting to re-think the fading. Between thinning the splitter supports and reworking the intake seam on the right side, I have some touch painting to do anyway. In the pictures below the two planes are wearing a slightly different camo pattern - most noticeable on the nose and right intake. The lower aircraft and the bottom picture are wearing what looks to be the scheme on the Zotz decal sheet. Chaff/Flare dispensers: Best as I can tell from just a few pictures, the 388TFW Phantoms did not have the chaff/flare dispensers (AN/ALE-40) on the pylons. If anyone has pictures to the contrary, please do share!! The pylons pictured below do not have the systems. Below is also a really nice view of the two-tone radome nose cone. Matte tip and glossy base. Notice the hard line on the camo and a general lack of fading. And just a quick look at some of the stenciling head on a general Phantom... 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martinnfb Posted June 1 Share Posted June 1 Smooth work Chris, I like how involved is your research. Every detail is accounted for. Cheers Martin 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CANicoll Posted June 1 Author Share Posted June 1 Thank you, Martin! I do try and learn about the subject I'm building, especially if it's a specific aircraft. Finding out about the pilots who flew specific WWII aircraft brought a new level of interest to me for the hobby. Looking to do the same here. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peterpools Posted June 1 Share Posted June 1 Chris Some mighty nice progress and your researching is paying off. The last few photographs show the F4's very clean and not faded and that would be my preferred way of going. I'm still not sold that masks/hard line cammo is the right way to go but the images do show the cammo is tight and no over spray at all. A tough decision for sure. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CANicoll Posted June 2 Author Share Posted June 2 (edited) Worked on the paint, trying to tone down the mottled/faded effect, but still trying NOT to have it all monotone. The pictures do show a little variation so that's the goal. Tomorrow will see about getting the next color down - light green. Started working on the splitter supports, thinning them down. Wish I had seen this before attaching the intakes. Would have been MUCH easier then.... Tail is just sitting in place. While I was at it, primed the 3D Printed Reskit pylons and I think they came out very nicely. Might be TOO much detail, but this is what they look like after a coat of primer - no washes, no highlighting. Started researching the colors for the missiles - as both Sidewinders and Sparrows have multiple color options. A bit of distress, Vietnam-era F-4's did not have AIM-9L Sidewinder missiles (which are what the Reskit missiles are). Seems like the bulk of the Sidewinders were 9Js. Blast. Also decided to go with white bodies on the missiles. The Sidewinders starting from behind the front fins to the tip is a grey/gunmetal with the rest being white. There is a Light Gray option on the Sparrows, but from contemporary pictures of the Vietnam-theater F-4s the Sparrows seem to be all white. These look to be AIM-9J Sidewinders based on the front fins. I may just have to go with it. Four Sidewinders and Four Sparrows. And the missiles I SHOULD have ordered... f AIM-9L This represents the load-out I'm planning on using. Edited June 2 by CANicoll Update 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DocRob Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 Nice progress with the started painting phase, Chris. I hear you on faded or not. A bit of fading should enhance the look of the finished model, I think. Cheers Rob 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peterpools Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 Chris Looking mighty good and you have to be commended on your continuing research - always new information seems to come to the forefront just after you pass that point or discovered the AM you purchased, in the case the wrong Sidewinder version - J's instead of L's. I'm still out to lunch on the painting modulation but with the F4 being so big, some should enhance the model. Holy smokes the detail on the pylons are amazing and look so good. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlrwestSiR Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 Lots of great progress there Chris. For the load out, I think most USAF F-4s carried an ECM pod in one of the front Sparrow bays. You can see it in the pic you posted with the two F-4s banking. There should be one in the kit but AM ones are available. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CANicoll Posted June 2 Author Share Posted June 2 Carl, As always, thanks for your help. I found this on BritModeller to help with the answer of what type of ECM pod: F-4E ECM pods for Vietnam 1972 - Aircraft Cold War - Britmodeller.com. If I decide the AM route, I may just go ahead and order the correct Sidewinders along with the ECM pod. I know that will bug me every time I see look at the plane after it is done. When I get home will see which ECM came with the Tamiya kit and if I want to use that. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlrwestSiR Posted June 2 Share Posted June 2 Reskit makes the ALQ-87 which is the one in the pic. https://reskit-models.com/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=5450 They have an early and a late so just need to narrow down which one. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CANicoll Posted June 3 Author Share Posted June 3 Carl, Perfect. That is the one I found too and have in the SB shopping basket, along with the correct Sidewinders. I'm opting for the late model ALQ-87, just because. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CANicoll Posted June 3 Author Share Posted June 3 First, had to deal with some intake-seam stuff. On the right side the intake pulled away from the fuselage so had to re-attach that and add some filler to smooth out the joint. On the left side, I guess I missed that there was a slight gap. So had to spend some time on that. Moved on to starting to assemble the Sparrow missiles and this is going to be an exercise in patience. The front fins are easy to remove from the pour block. It is a simple cut across the base and a bit of sanding touch up. The rear fins are a totally different problem. They are smaller than the front fins but the attachment lug stands proud of the base of the fin. What is an easy removal of the front fin becomes at least a five-step process to remove the rear fin from the base. The larger front fin is on the left, and the smaller rear fin is on the right. The fit on the missile body seems pretty tight. f 16 down, 16 to go.. Ugh. Plus 32 more on the Sidewinders... This old razor knife is working wonders. Even with the broken blade, the two sides, fine and medium, make short work of the resin. Then comes priming, painting and decaling. (And I do have other blades for the razor knife, but this one keeps on working.) 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlrwestSiR Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 Nice work on the Sparrow fins. Reminds me of individual track links. I think the late ALQ-87 sounds right too. I've got the JLC razor saw as well. Great tool and yup, mine is broken also. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CANicoll Posted June 3 Author Share Posted June 3 7 hours ago, BlrwestSiR said: Nice work on the Sparrow fins. Reminds me of individual track links. I think the late ALQ-87 sounds right too. I've got the JLC razor saw as well. Great tool and yup, mine is broken also. Then I'm in excellent company! The blade is so thin, but I like it. Thx on the ALQ-87. I just ordered from BNA. SB hasn't had the resin tires/wheels in stock for quite a while, but BNA has those, the Sidewinders and the ALQ in stock - and a few $$ US cheaper than SB so win, win. In the meantime, I can keep going on the build. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CANicoll Posted June 4 Author Share Posted June 4 So the challenge with the Sidewinders and the ALQ has taken another turn. Thanks to good old Facebook and someone posting family pics, from Korat no less, I have a confirmation and an 'aw crap' to report. Not even 24 hours after I ordered the new Sidewinders and the ALQ from BNA, I took a look at these pictures. The tail number is right in the range of the Zotz decal sheet, this aircraft is 276 while the decals span 268-380. What luck! Nice glossy nose but that is something of an aberration - as you will see in other pictures. Notice the sidewinders, however. More on that in a minute. Also, the skewed paint line on the nose of the right fuel tank. Never seen that before. Really nice shot of the ALQ. Thanks Carl for the suggestion. Also what looks to be a soft demarcation line on the camo. At scale, would it look like a hard line? It kind of does in the picture above. Here, the intake splitter is smooth, not perforated like I've seen before. Hmmm.. Really clear shot of the ALQ and the Sidewinders. I guess I didn't need to get different ones after all... Also, I don't see a lot of stenciling on this aircraft. And back to the nose cone... So will probably just keep going with the Sidewinders I have and wait on the ALQ and Resin tires. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlrwestSiR Posted June 4 Share Posted June 4 Some really nice pics there Chris. The intake splitter is definitely perforated. They all were. Something to do with the air flow. Excess air taken in through the perforations gets expelled through the vents on the top and bottom. The radome being fibreglass might explain the differing finishes seen. Some were even tan and not black. When you get to the wing tanks, they need to be moved outboard. Let me check how far out they need to be moved. I keep remembering stuff as I follow your build. Hopefully it comes in time. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CANicoll Posted June 5 Author Share Posted June 5 Carl, Thanks! I'll be working on the missiles and paint/camo for a few weeks so let me know what you find on the location of the wing tanks, and how to reduce the angle of outer wing panels. Your help is invaluable, and very much appreciated! The Reskit missiles are terrific, but a chore to remove from the pour blocks. Got the Sparrow parts separated. The Reskit resin is interesting - easy to sand (carefully!) and saw. The resin is a bit more flexible than styrene, but also seems to be softer. One down! I wish I had a jig to make sure the fins are straight and aligned... Left the pour block on to use as a base while the fins are attached. 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GusMac Posted June 5 Share Posted June 5 SNAP! Guess what I was building tonight as well. Haven't started on the Sidewinders yet but these look great, although some of the fins had a slight twist. As Chris says the resin is quite soft so they bent back to shape quite easily. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CANicoll Posted June 6 Author Share Posted June 6 Gus, I had exactly the same experience with the twist of some fins. And one of the Sparrow bodies seems to be a bit warped, but not quite a badly as the one on the left in your picture. What did you use to attach the fins? I used a gel CA. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GusMac Posted June 6 Share Posted June 6 Hi Chris, I used Bob Smith CA to glue the fins and they went on okay. It doesn't dry too fast so you've a bit of time to get them straight. I've tried fitting that one on the left against the resin pylon and I'm hoping it'll straighten out okay with some CA to hold it in place. Failing that I'll try one of the others from the box as the load for this is 2 Sparrows and 4 Sidewinders so I've a couple to play with. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CANicoll Posted June 6 Author Share Posted June 6 2 hours ago, GusMac said: Hi Chris, I used Bob Smith CA to glue the fins and they went on okay. It doesn't dry too fast so you've a bit of time to get them straight. I've tried fitting that one on the left against the resin pylon and I'm hoping it'll straighten out okay with some CA to hold it in place. Failing that I'll try one of the others from the box as the load for this is 2 Sparrows and 4 Sidewinders so I've a couple to play with. I think you can also try putting it in hot water (no pun intended) and then straightening it out. Maybe tape it to a straight bar, pen or something while it cools? 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlrwestSiR Posted June 7 Share Posted June 7 Chris, here's the jig for setting the outer wing angle that I have. http://nautilusmodels.com/32-802.htm The angle is 12.5° otherwise. As for the wing pylons, they need to move inboard 4.7mm 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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