SapperSix Posted April 20, 2019 Author Share Posted April 20, 2019 Gaz, I am fanatical about hockey, whiskey and..............and..............I will have to get back to you. A dusting of grey combined with the black wash you speak of are the likely approach. I want to be very careful to not overload the pallet....Thank you for your input. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SapperSix Posted April 23, 2019 Author Share Posted April 23, 2019 Lots of ground covered over the last couple days. I have found myself with a bit more free time than usual and have spent some of it on the work bench. Lots of paint shading and detail on the fuselage. Many hues of of the camouflage were experimented with. In the end I am very happy and eager to see the final harmony of it all. In some areas I did get a little loose with maintenance wear and tear. More on that later. I spent some time looking at the flare dispensers for fit and finish. I noticed that after all the re scribing and riveting alterations and modifications I made on the plane, I failed to make the changes in this area. I dont think I am going to re do the work. I will at least sleep on it. I turned the paint being taken off from the tape in to chipping. And did some real chipping. . The center line tank and some experimentation. More to follow. For the tires I had to make custom masks from Parafilm. The center of the main landing gear is actually painted in the old testors rubber color and not flat black. Its going to end up with a much more rusted look and the testors rubber paint already leans that direction. A little chipping was also applied. Dry brushing and pastels to come. I will come back tomorrow and give more detail. Time for bed after a good day on the bench. Thanks for looking and all the fine advice. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GazzaS Posted April 23, 2019 Share Posted April 23, 2019 Frank, Glad to see you powering along. Gaz 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Posted April 23, 2019 Share Posted April 23, 2019 I need a tutorial on the chipping method....................................... when you have time............ the fuel tanks look excellent... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SapperSix Posted April 26, 2019 Author Share Posted April 26, 2019 On 4/23/2019 at 12:42 AM, GazzaS said: Frank, Glad to see you powering along. Gaz Gaz, It has been a real pleasure to focus, completely, on modeling. Its a rare thing in my life, but I predict more bench time in the coming months. On 4/23/2019 at 5:15 AM, Jeff said: I need a tutorial on the chipping method....................................... when you have time............ the fuel tanks look excellent... Google is far more knowledgeable than I. However, below is how I did it, your experience or technique will vary... 1.) Good base primer (Dry overnight) 2.) Cover primer with coat of paint to be the exposed through the chipping process. I used MM Steel, and Chrome Silver. (Dry overnight) 3.) Put a nice coat of hair spray down. I used Aussie hair spray, decanted, as that is what I was able to steal from the wife and daughter. Then mixed with a little bit of Tamiya X-20 Thinner. About 50/50 mix, although your spraying technique may require something different. Thickness of this coat seems to affect the type and depth of chipping. I am still getting familiar with this technique. (Dry overnight) (You can put down multiple coats of hair spray and chipping paint layer to create two or more layers of chipped paint) 4.) Put main camo coat down. (Dry overnight) 5.) I used a wet Q-Tip to rub on the paint until chipping began. This length of time and amount of pressure that is to be applied depends on the paint and thickness of coats. I also used a toothpick that had the sharp end dulled a little to make deeper more obvious chipping. 6.) And then I augmented using the fine paintbrush chipping method to replicate fine chipping. I have seen people say you can only do this with a acrylics or maybe enamels. I have used a mix of both and while there at are differences it always has seemed to work. I am sure there is someone that is expert on this that might expand on this. Thank you for the kind words. More detailing to come on those tanks... 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SapperSix Posted April 26, 2019 Author Share Posted April 26, 2019 I am amazed how deep the hole can be when one is tracking down information when striving for a painfully accurate build. I have began to understand the pain of those we call bolt counters. The below work took a good bit longer than I had expected. Just to put a few placards on I kept finding different or incomplete information. The main wheel well cover had a multitude of varying examples. By the time I said "Screw it, get it done!" about 4 hours had passed as I tracked various references and online sources. The Eduard placards had incorrect colors for the afore mentioned placard for the RF-4C. Which led to a little looking around. The speed breaks are very much straight forward. The ALQ-71 has completely false numbers and decals on it. I couldn't find many period examples. I was going to have to make some decals but instead opted to us some remainders to achieve an effect. Now I feel like I have cheated on a test....I will probably have to go back and make actual decals to assuage my mind. Still I have learned so very much. Having said that, my next build will probably OOB. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GazzaS Posted April 26, 2019 Share Posted April 26, 2019 57 minutes ago, SapperSix said: Now I feel like I have cheated on a test....I will probably have to go back and make actual decals to assuage my mind. You are entering stage 2 of "rivet-counter-itis". Further bouts of guilt and shame could cause a permanent addiction to strenuous researching, and of course... counting rivets. I prescribed taking two "f*ckitall" three times a day on an empty stomach with at least 8 liquid OZ. of whiskey per dose. As an added measure I suggest watching the movie Stripes with Bill Murray. Gaz 5 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SapperSix Posted April 26, 2019 Author Share Posted April 26, 2019 Oh that was pure genius Gaz.......I am off to get the whiskey. Too funny!! 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peterpools Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 Frank Awesome progress on the detailing and cammo/weathering. Looking mighty good and the weathering is spot on. Keep 'em comin Peter 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 So as I am an enamel guy, I am supposing that can be used as well as you mention........ I am trying to step into the 'dark' side of acrylics, but as my past experience wasn't good ( years ago before new technology) I am hesitant to step into the deep end of the pool....... Thanks for putting it in layman's terms too..... I will most likely give that go............. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GusMac Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 Stripes! Now that is a blast from the past. Great movie with Murray and the last, great Harold Ramis. Remember many drunken evenings with my mates watching that on VHS 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SapperSix Posted May 4, 2019 Author Share Posted May 4, 2019 On 4/27/2019 at 5:55 AM, Jeff said: So as I am an enamel guy, I am supposing that can be used as well as you mention........ I am trying to step into the 'dark' side of acrylics, but as my past experience wasn't good ( years ago before new technology) I am hesitant to step into the deep end of the pool....... Thanks for putting it in layman's terms too..... I will most likely give that go............. Give it a go. For me enamels just took more work to expose the chipping layer. I have never used enamels to perform double layered chipping and acrylics seem to come off a little easier. But again, density of coat seems to make a big difference. You are welcome, anytime. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SapperSix Posted May 4, 2019 Author Share Posted May 4, 2019 On 4/27/2019 at 12:21 PM, GusMac said: Stripes! Now that is a blast from the past. Great movie with Murray and the last, great Harold Ramis. Remember many drunken evenings with my mates watching that on VHS AARRMMYY Training!!! 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SapperSix Posted May 4, 2019 Author Share Posted May 4, 2019 I was getting ready to put some primer on the NMF tail of the Phantom. That's when I noticed that the rivets are all wrong, far too small. The reference picture verses what Revell did.......big difference. What to do? So looked at some other builds. The examples I found were few. Enlarging the rivets in the tail section would be a multi part process. I did choose to use the diameter of 2MM for the new rivets, not to scale, but I already had the 2MM drill and some wire or plastic round tube at the same diameter. I wasn't willing to place another order for a punch or more stuff. So I will have get rid of the small Revell rivets and replace with a large diameter washer and rivet. I am using the 2mm hand drill to get a MM deep or so. Then cutting some lead wire, putting it in the hole to be lightly sanded later to replicate the washer. I cant decide how I am going to recreate the actual rivet (If thats what it is). Making the new holes, and looking as to how I am going to plug the old small ones. All the rows of larger rivets are now drilled. Two of them with the first lead large rivet attempts. If someone else has any ideas on this I am open to learning..... 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GazzaS Posted May 5, 2019 Share Posted May 5, 2019 Do you have a beading tool, mate? 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harv Posted May 5, 2019 Share Posted May 5, 2019 I have the Tamiya and its a bit different. The front ones, that you are working on were quite good. The back ones, no. It looks like they are missing from yours also. This is what I did lots of little punched disc and then sanded back. Could work for you using larger discs and small divit in the midle. Just an idea. BTW, this build rocks ~......harv 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bomber_County Posted May 5, 2019 Share Posted May 5, 2019 Stunning build, I’ve just had one of those “rivet counter” moments and my goodness Gaz’s method works...... Frank seriously awesome build, I’ve a ZM F4J waiting........ 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SapperSix Posted May 5, 2019 Author Share Posted May 5, 2019 16 hours ago, GazzaS said: Do you have a beading tool, mate? Gaz as always you are very helpful. Much appreciated. Looks like I am in the market. This model has doubled the amount of tools that I have used in the past. I think maybe I have become...A RIVET COUNTER!!(Que scary music). But man is this fun. And I really want to achieve the many things I see happening in other builds. And so I go, further down the rat hole. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SapperSix Posted May 5, 2019 Author Share Posted May 5, 2019 6 hours ago, harv said: I have the Tamiya and its a bit different. The front ones, that you are working on were quite good. The back ones, no. It looks like they are missing from yours also. This is what I did lots of little punched disc and then sanded back. Could work for you using larger discs and small divit in the midle. Just an idea. BTW, this build rocks ~......harv Harv, you are spot on. The Revell even has the wrong rivets in the wrong place. Depending on time today I will get a picture up of all the changes, tail and rivet wise, for any modelers that might want to bring the pain upon themselves...If I had a punch set I would have zoomed through this instead of buggering through it. Such is experience. However, I learned things for other models. Never a bad build in my mind.....Nice upgrade to the Tamiya. You have created what I am going for. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SapperSix Posted May 5, 2019 Author Share Posted May 5, 2019 3 hours ago, Bomber_County said: Stunning build, I’ve just had one of those “rivet counter” moments and my goodness Gaz’s method works...... Frank seriously awesome build, I’ve a ZM F4J waiting........ Yes, rivet counting......just a year ago I used to build a model and be happy with my techniques. Then I got a little time one day and decided to log on to a modeling site as I had not engaged before. And I have been running ever since. It seems to be getting worse for sure....I might need an intervention. Having said that I am soooo much happier with the techniques I have learned and the detail of my models. The pocket book is a bit flat though.... Thank you for the kind words. Given your builds I have much more to learn. I have been looking at the cockpit and want to do it all over again, even though it set a personal bench mark. I have not a single ZM in my stash. Christmas for sure! Once you start your build you can bet I will be watching as I have another Phantom in waiting. See you at the workbench!! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SapperSix Posted May 13, 2019 Author Share Posted May 13, 2019 Man'o'man am I getting a bit of a butt kicking. I have never worked with Alclad despite having it in my possession of many years. Just didn't have the guts to do any NMF work. Well, I have to say I love the product as it really works well, very well in fact. What I didn't count on is the primer showing every little tiny bit of CA glue that is in, on or around the custom made rivets on the tail....Sooooooo many little specs or CA that oozed out from under the rivet to make it look horrible. So.......Off it goes. I was planning on complete removal and starting all over again. I didn't want to get a punch set just yet, but I did. (I have caught the disease. Just have to wait for it o be shipped.) As I was using the CA de bonder I noticed it may be removing the wild glue specs and maybe complete removal may not be necessary. Jury is still out. A complete repainting of the NMF tail will be required and it looks like the de bonder may be roughing up the plastic a little. I will know more tonight. Off to cook dinner for my wonderful wife and family. I hope you all had a great mothers day!! I spent two days on the feathers. Lots of experimentation. The left is finalized with a soap based sludge wash. I love the sludge wash as its easy to take off its not right. And I am thinking the left one is a bit much for a phantom. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harv Posted May 13, 2019 Share Posted May 13, 2019 Never too much on a bird that smoked as much as a phantom ! Dirty birds. I think it looks great.....harv 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Posted May 16, 2019 Share Posted May 16, 2019 On 5/13/2019 at 10:18 AM, harv said: Never too much on a bird that smoked as much as a phantom ! Dirty birds. I think it looks great.....harv weren't the notoriously dirty at the back end, I remember seeing the Thunderbirds Phantom that was the 'slot' bird and it's whole tail was black with soot..... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Posted May 16, 2019 Share Posted May 16, 2019 like this, and I think this is VERY cool, loved the 'Smoker"................... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Posted May 16, 2019 Share Posted May 16, 2019 when airshows were really cool... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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