Israeli Mirage III C with Atar9C

[Kaireckstadt]

Next update: glued the fuselage-halfs together and the wing-upper-parts to it. Only small corrections with sheet necessary due to a gap in the wingroot at the leading edge.

Then I made a test-fit of the complete assemblies. Was the right decision to go this way of assembly: Fit of vertical tail, tail, cockpit-section and even the intake and the nose is acceptable. Not Tamiya quality but handable with usual (Italeri-) rework.
Also a quite visible big ejector pin-mark in the intake. The Italeri engineers seem to be no model builders...
Starts to look like a Mirage...

[GazzaS]

Fabulous!  Starting to look like an airplane!

[DocRob]

1 hour ago, Kaireckstadt said:

„Regal des Untergangs“

I'm a bloody German as well and my English has more holes than the Mirage has shape issues Kai. I love your translation of SOD, sounds like a good title for a very bad movie, which can be a lot of fun.

In your test fit the Mirage shows her real beauty and pays back for some of the burdens, if you don't look to close,...
Lots of work ahead, but also a picture of how she will look in the end.

Cheers Rob

[Kaireckstadt]

4 hours ago, DocRob said:

I'm a bloody German as well and my English has more holes than the Mirage has shape issues Kai. I love your translation of SOD, sounds like a good title for a very bad movie, which can be a lot of fun.

In your test fit the Mirage shows her real beauty and pays back for some of the burdens, if you don't look to close,...
Lots of work ahead, but also a picture of how she will look in the end.

Cheers Rob

Thanks Rob! Never thought that you are German too!

Your interpretation to my translation is really creative! Haven’t thought of that! 
I also love the shape of delta-planes. Started with the Me 163 in WWII and ended with the SR71 which I will buy in 48 scale when the new Revell Kit is available this year...This one will be big...

You’re right,  now starts the chapter with sanding and rescribing. Always my favorite work...

But before I will assemble and paint the exhaust. 

[Kaireckstadt]

Yesterday I started the job which isn’t one of my favorites: sanding and rescribing. What is a simple job on a Tamiya-kit (on my Corsair it was limited to really nothing, that’s what I call good engineering) is a huge one on an Italeri-kit!

The first thing I corrected was the really big ejector pin-marks on the intakes. I filled them with superglue and sanded the whole surface:

What I usually do before painting is to check with a color-wash if something has to be corrected:

As you can see, everything was ok. Cleaned it up again with Mr. Color Thinner (not the leveling thinner) which doesn’t react with the plastic. You can even use it to clean up glass-parts if you had a mishap during painting. Saves a lot of work with sanding and polishing.

Now I can paint it again.

I also sanded the upper fuselage part and started the rescribing and riveting process:

The job on the base of the vertical tail will be more time consuming due to the bad fit:

And the end part:

That’s all for today.

Happy Easter and happy modeling!

Kai

 

 

 

[GazzaS]

Kai,

     Your efforts look good.   You've done great to reach this point.  Should be a smashing looking model.

Re-scribing is one of my most hated tasks.  It not the doing that I hate.  It's the failure.  The only positive aspect to me is using CA as a filler because every time I mess it up, I can re-fill and re-scribe in only a few minutes.  My favorite scribing tool is a half of a razor saw blade.

 

Gaz

[Kaireckstadt]

2 hours ago, GazzaS said:

Kai,

     Your efforts look good.   You've done great to reach this point.  Should be a smashing looking model.

Re-scribing is one of my most hated tasks.  It not the doing that I hate.  It's the failure.  The only positive aspect to me is using CA as a filler because every time I mess it up, I can re-fill and re-scribe in only a few minutes.  My favorite scribing tool is a half of a razor saw blade.

 

Gaz

Thanks Gaz!

I‘m using absolutely the same method.
But for the rescribing I use another selfmade tool. It‘s a needle put into a handle. 

For the deeper ones I use a tool from Trumpeter and for guiding of the tools I use Dymo-Tape. 

[Peterpools]

Kai

Awesome progress - your Mirage is coming together so nicely and all the tweaking and hard work is paying off. Completely agree; those injector pin marks - unbelievable.

Keep 'em comin

Peter

[Trigger]

On 4/3/2021 at 10:22 AM, Kaireckstadt said:

Next update: glued the fuselage-halfs together and the wing-upper-parts to it. Only small corrections with sheet necessary due to a gap in the wingroot at the leading edge.

Then I made a test-fit of the complete assemblies. Was the right decision to go this way of assembly: Fit of vertical tail, tail, cockpit-section and even the intake and the nose is acceptable. Not Tamiya quality but handable with usual (Italeri-) rework.
Also a quite visible big ejector pin-mark in the intake. The Italeri engineers seem to be no model builders...
Starts to look like a Mirage...

Hello kai,

Great progress, I pulled out my mirage to compare if it has the same issues as yours, I remember that I also had issues with the fit of the intakes (see pictures), what is also pretty annoying is that there is a seam that runs through the Panel from top to bottom, a lot of filling to get that right, why could those guys at Italeri not come with a better idea or design for that? , but never the less it still is the only kit available in 1/32  scale that comes close to a mirage. you just have to put in a lot of effort to get there, and looking at your cockpit I know you will do the mirage justice , keep working like this and you will end up with a great Mirage,

 

[Kaireckstadt]

3 hours ago, Trigger said:

Hello kai,

Great progress, I pulled out my mirage to compare if it has the same issues as yours, I remember that I also had issues with the fit of the intakes (see pictures), what is also pretty annoying is that there is a seam that runs through the Panel from top to bottom, a lot of filling to get that right, why could those guys at Italeri not come with a better idea or design for that? , but never the less it still is the only kit available in 1/32  scale that comes close to a mirage. you just have to put in a lot of effort to get there, and looking at your cockpit I know you will do the mirage justice , keep working like this and you will end up with a great Mirage,

 

Thank you, Trigger

It‘s really a mess and I have often asked myself if the engineers who designed that kit ever build it or even are modellers at all. 

When I had stuck to the assembly instructions I would have run into real trouble. Fortunately I have some modeling friends who gave me some tipps how to avoid some of the biggest problems. Another friend of mine who built it according to the instructions had so big problems with the fit of the intakes that he at least threw it into the bin.
This is why I want to share all my experiences here with you and get tipps how to make the assembly easier. 

Your pictures show that you have solved these problems very good but only with a big amount of extra work. Yours will also end as a great looking Mirage I‘m sure.

Regarding the intakes I will shorten them drastically and I will not include the tunnel to the engine intake. The intakes are so small that nothing of it can be seen in the end.

This will reduce the assembly to 2 parts which can be assembled after the marriage of the upper and lower fuselage halfs. Hope that the alignment will be much more easier and better then. This will be the topic of one of my next posts. 
 

Cheers

Kai

 

[Kaireckstadt]

22 hours ago, Peterpools said:

Kai

Awesome progress - your Mirage is coming together so nicely and all the tweaking and hard work is paying off. Completely agree; those injector pin marks - unbelievable.

Keep 'em comin

Peter

Thank you Peter,

This build really is a challenge and even more challenging than the 104 I‘ve build.

I hope that all the work will pay off in the end but still a long way to go...

[Kaireckstadt]

Further progress on the build. 
Glued the fuselage-halfs together step-by-step starting with the cockpit-section to achieve a good fit mainly of the intake parts of the lower half to the upper half.
Next step was glueing of the wing-section and finally the tail. The only gap to fill was under the left wing:

The intake construction is really a mess with so many corners and edges to align. I shortened the intake ramp for easier assembly and made a test-fit with  the outer-parts. 

The only thing to correct is that the pins have to be enlarged to fill the gap between them and the fuselage respectively them and the brass-parts which have to be added. Otherwise the fit is really good.

 

Next thing was to add nose weight (lead-foil stripes which are flexible)and glue the nose to the fuselage:

The best fit of the nose can be achieved when you grind away all alignment stuff and glue it butt to the fuselage. There are still some fit-issues which can be solved with sanding and rescribing:

Final step was to add the tail cone out of the Isracast-Set for the Atar 9C engine. Unfortunately the diameter of the part is  too small and a lot of work will be required to correct this. I made no mistake with the alignment of the rear fuselage. I didn’t expect that and I‘m really disappointed of the Isracast quality:

With pressure and superglue the result looks like this:

The nozzle itself fits good and has crisp details but also will be refined.

So this is how the bird looks like in the moment:

Next step will be the painting of the intake inner and outer parts which cannot be airbrushed when assembled and their assembly and the rework of the nose, tail and wing underside.

 

[GazzaS]

Kai,

   You've done a great job fitting everything together.  It's a shame that the resin part fit so poorly.  Hopefully cleaning up the join won't cost you too much surface detail.

 

It is starting to look like a jet fighter, though!

 

Gaz

[DocRob]

Wow, that's quite a bit of (unnecessary and only lacking design infused) extra work, but as far as you done it, it will be masterclass in the end. I'm not much into jets, but some, I like E.G. the F-104, Phantom, Mig-21, Lightning and the Mirage. I doubt, that I will build many of them and have only a 1/48 Eduard Phantom and a Mig-21 in my stash. If you need a cool jet, which is a pure pleasure build, try the AMK Mig-31. It's so well designed, especially around the often problematic intakes. All mayor seams are hidden through design magic The kit needs no filler and nearly no glue and you could put it together within a timeframe you need to overwork the intakes of the Mirage. I wish, the Italeri engineers would inspect the MIG closely and try to learn something. 
The benefit for us though, we can learn a lot from your build and which techniques you use, to ship around the obstacles. I'm sure, you will have pulled an eye catching soon.

Cheers Rob

[Kaireckstadt]

8 hours ago, GazzaS said:

Kai,

   You've done a great job fitting everything together.  It's a shame that the resin part fit so poorly.  Hopefully cleaning up the join won't cost you too much surface detail.

 

It is starting to look like a jet fighter, though!

 

Gaz

Thanks Gaz!

I think that it will cost nearly all the surface-details. But I‘m used to rescribing on an Italeri kit...

One friend of mine said to me that after an Italeri kit you have to build a Tamiya one to relax...

[Kaireckstadt]

5 hours ago, DocRob said:

Wow, that's quite a bit of (unnecessary and only lacking design infused) extra work, but as far as you done it, it will be masterclass in the end. I'm not much into jets, but some, I like E.G. the F-104, Phantom, Mig-21, Lightning and the Mirage. I doubt, that I will build many of them and have only a 1/48 Eduard Phantom and a Mig-21 in my stash. If you need a cool jet, which is a pure pleasure build, try the AMK Mig-31. It's so well designed, especially around the often problematic intakes. All mayor seams are hidden through design magic The kit needs no filler and nearly no glue and you could put it together within a timeframe you need to overwork the intakes of the Mirage. I wish, the Italeri engineers would inspect the MIG closely and try to learn something. 
The benefit for us though, we can learn a lot from your build and which techniques you use, to ship around the obstacles. I'm sure, you will have pulled an eye catching soon.

Cheers Rob

Thank you Rob!

That’s the load you have to carry when building an Italeri kit. It’s time consuming but on the other hand also challenging. 

Interesting tipp with the MiG 31. I will take a look at it. Was the same with the Tamiya F4U1-A Corsair. Beautiful engineering and no putty! Have another one in my stash when I need a relaxed build! 

We should send your advice each of us to Italeri. This would really help! 

You also mentioned what is one of the most important things for me to be part of this community: To share experiences with each other, to learn new techniques and to give feedback and tipps regarding actual builds. 
 

Cheers

Kai

 

[Trigger]

4 minutes ago, Kaireckstadt said:

Thank you Rob!

That’s the load you have to carry when building an Italeri kit. It’s time consuming but on the other hand also challenging. 

Interesting tipp with the MiG 31. I will take a look at it. Was the same with the Tamiya F4U1-A Corsair. Beautiful engineering and no putty! Have another one in my stash when I need a relaxed build! 

We should send your advice each of us to Italeri. This would really help! 

You also mentioned what is one of the most important things for me to be part of this community: To share experiences with each other, to learn new techniques and to give feedback and tipps regarding actual builds. 
 

Cheers

Kai

 

Hai Kai, I immediately looked at my mirage, I can not remember having those fit issues, but is has been a while for me since I started it, it might as well have been the reason why I shelved this project, but you persevered and you've nailed it, don't be discouraged, in the end when you can begin putting paint on it will all be forgotten.......

I do remember that those intakes are a real nightmare to get right, I think you made the right decision to cut them up, one way ore the other you have to make it work for you, but it can be discouraging to a point that you give up (like I did), but don't do that please, you'll get there in the end.......

Frank

 

[harv]

Its been a battle, but your winning. Like Frank said,  don't give up on it. It will be a winner ....harv

[Kaireckstadt]

3 minutes ago, Trigger said:

Hai Kai, I immediately looked at my mirage, I can not remember having those fit issues, but is has been a while for me since I started it, it might as well have been the reason why I shelved this project, but you persevered and you've nailed it, don't be discouraged, in the end when you can begin putting paint on it will all be forgotten.......

I do remember that those intakes are a real nightmare to get right, I think you made the right decision to cut them up, one way ore the other you have to make it work for you, but it can be discouraging to a point that you give up (like I did), but don't do that please, you'll get there in the end.......

Frank

 

Thanks for your reply Frank! It seems that I got a part from Isracast that shrunk a little. Your fit of the aft fuselage looks like mine. So it is likely that I didn’t make a mistake. 
And the fit of your cone is much more better than mine. 

I won’t give up. Since the part is attached to the tail now it’s only a lot of rework necessary. But nothing which cannot be solved. I’ve never thrown a model into the bin due to assembly issues. Do not plan to fo it with this one. Thanks for your motivation! 

The intakes now fit well and need some touch-ups but nothing really challenging. I‘ve already painted them in places which cannot be reached with the airbrush when glued together.

 

Paints are from a set from AK Real Color. 

Now I can go on with fitting of the intakes and the fuselage rework. 
Once again thanks for your feedback
 

Cheers

Kai

 

[Kaireckstadt]

14 minutes ago, harv said:

Its been a battle, but your winning. Like Frank said,  don't give up on it. It will be a winner ....harv

Thanks a lot Harv! I‘ll do my very best..

[HubertB]

Amazing dedication there   !

There are a few iconic jets for me, like the EE Lightning, the Panther/Cougar family, the Cutlass (yeah, I know  ...), the Crusader, the Saab Tunnan and Draken... and the Mirage III !

So it’s really a pity that Italeri did such a half-hearted job on the Mirage. On the one hand, they used high-end molding technology like slide molds on the fuselage, and on the other hand, all the molds are done approximately ( for instance the slide mold joint line on the fuselage), with ejection marks ill-placed, poor fit, etc. 

This was understandable when molds were milled from a hand-made master with a pantograph, not with today’s 3D design and high-end CNC milling. If WnW or Tamiya can produce kits with VERY tight tolerances, Italeri could at least have gone with 0.1 mm ones ...

Excellent job, Kai. Both on the modelling side, and on convincing me not to spend a dime with this kit  . I can live with shrunk resin kits, scratchbuilding size discrepancies, but, iconic or not, the subject is not enough in my main-interest league to go for this kind of aggravation.

Hubert

[GusMac]

That's a bummer with the fit of the tail part Kai but I'm sure you'll make it work.

Just out of interest, how much weight did you add to the nose? I'm hoping the big resin nose for the Cheetah will help but I'd be keen to know how much is enough.

[Martinnfb]

Just catching up with this fantastic build. Very inspiring indeed.

Cheers

Martin

[GazzaS]

Yay!  It's always good to see a splash of color!  I hafta admit I like most IDF color schemes.  Especially with those big triangles!

 

Gaz

[Kaireckstadt]

12 hours ago, HubertB said:

Amazing dedication there   !

There are a few iconic jets for me, like the EE Lightning, the Panther/Cougar family, the Cutlass (yeah, I know  ...), the Crusader, the Saab Tunnan and Draken... and the Mirage III !

So it’s really a pity that Italeri did such a half-hearted job on the Mirage. On the one hand, they used high-end molding technology like slide molds on the fuselage, and on the other hand, all the molds are done approximately ( for instance the slide mold joint line on the fuselage), with ejection marks ill-placed, poor fit, etc. 

This was understandable when molds were milled from a hand-made master with a pantograph, not with today’s 3D design and high-end CNC milling. If WnW or Tamiya can produce kits with VERY tight tolerances, Italeri could at least have gone with 0.1 mm ones ...

Excellent job, Kai. Both on the modelling side, and on convincing me not to spend a dime with this kit  . I can live with shrunk resin kits, scratchbuilding size discrepancies, but, iconic or not, the subject is not enough in my main-interest league to go for this kind of aggravation.

Hubert

Thanks for your feedback Hubert!

You are totally right. Using newest technology and not using it thoughtful seems to be the problem of Italeri. 
The seam you mentioned wasn‘t easy to eliminate and the placement of the ejectors is also not the best possible solution.

Also the accuracy is lacking which I can’t understand because there are still so many aircraft and technical documentation available.

If I hadn’t promised to build one for the Telford Mirage SIG this year, I would have stopped it like Frank and started instead with a Tornado or my Dayglo G-91. And I never have stopped a build so far!

BTW: You really have detailed technical knowledge of the injection molding technology and 3D-Printing! Very interesting!

Thanks again and 

Cheers 

Kai