Share how COVID-19 Quarantine has affected you.

[harv]

Very sorry to hear Brad......harv

[harv]

Speaking of friends, has anyone had contact with Dale ?.....harv

[Martinnfb]

Suicides, bankruptcies and divorces will lead the victim statistics of this virus show. 

[Wumm]

On 7/17/2020 at 8:51 AM, harv said:

Speaking of friends, has anyone had contact with Dale ?.....harv

No Harv, haven't seen him here since April. Although he's known to disappear for a time, it's concerning in the current environment. I've searched for Male statistics from Newtown in the Covid data, but have come up short. But if anything were to happen to him, it might not even be Covid... I don't know if the extensive bombardment his immune system was subjected to even allows him to make new T-cells to fight off even the common cold.

Note that I'm referring to Dale in the present tense. Hoping he's still around but just laying low.

The Border between Queensland and New South Wales... This entry point in the Rabbit-proof fence isn't usually Manned, especially on weekends; so you just shut the gate behind you as you pass, as you would do on any other Rural property.  This is a FWD-only track that loops into the neighbouring State for a half hour jaunt and turns back north without accessing any other main roads. So it's clear the Authorities aren't taking any chances in keeping the border closed here.

S

[harv]

Thanks. I had his Email addy but cant find it....harv

[TonyWills]

On 7/17/2020 at 12:05 AM, Martinnfb said:

Suicides, bankruptcies and divorces will lead the victim statistics of this virus show. 

It's not a "show". Ask the families & friends of one of the 140 000 who have died. As for "suicides leading the victim statistics"  I'm sure suicides will increase, but there is absolutely no evidence that they'll get anywhere near the average 1 000+ per day deaths attributable to coronavirus. The forecast for November is for total US Coronavirus deaths to be between 201 000 to 256 000 Americans. Almost a quarter of a million Americans. More than half the number of the total US military killed in almost 4 years of world war two. In eight months. With more deaths all the way into 2021. How people can have such a flippant attitude to so many of their countrymen dying, or falling seriously ill with life-changing injuries, is just wrong. And that's before we know what the long-term ramifications are for those who survive serious bouts of the virus. Some companies will go bankrupt. But companies will be reformed, it's the basis of capitalism and the American dream. The lives lost are lost forever, and had the country shut down longer, until the figures had declined sufficiently,  just as Europe did, the US would also be opening back up and infection rates and death rates would be far, far lower. I can understand the anger some people have because of the effect upon the economy, but to then belittle the virus, as if there was a choice to just ignore it and carry on, leading to even more deaths, is something I just don't understand. 

I'm sorry, I've already lost both family and friends to the coronavirus, including an old boss of mine who died at 49 with no pre-existing conditions whatsoever, so when I read stuff like this, it kinda makes me angry. I'll now fade into the background again, reading armour WIP's.

[Martinnfb]

Welcome to the forum Tony.

Just to explain my standpoint. I am not trying to downsize the loss of human life. I am trying to outline long term consequences of this outbreak. It is a ripple effect that we encounter after every major disaster in history. Studies were made numerous times showing that direct victims are not only the only victims.

No need to get angry or fade into the background.

[BradG]

Now we have to wear a mask while outside. This sounds like the old "pots and pans for Spitfires", makes people feel good but not particularly effective. Especially so as they said we can wear anything, so no hospital grade stuff that might make a difference, just wear some cloth around your face. Yeh, that's not going to protect you.

[GazzaS]

8 minutes ago, BradG said:

Now we have to wear a mask while outside. This sounds like the old "pots and pans for Spitfires", makes people feel good but not particularly effective. Especially so as they said we can wear anything, so no hospital grade stuff that might make a difference, just wear some cloth around your face. Yeh, that's not going to protect you.

No...  it doesn't protect you.  But it reduces the amount of water droplets from your mouth getting into the local atmosphere.  It protects other people from you.

 

[BradG]

30 minutes ago, GazzaS said:

No...  it doesn't protect you.  But it reduces the amount of water droplets from your mouth getting into the local atmosphere.  It protects other people from you.

 

It may have some effect there, but if you're sick you should be at home anyway. Which raises a concern about people feeling more protected, so taking more risks or staying out longer etc.  A

[Winnie]

BradG, the problem is you can be a carrier with no symptoms, hence, wear a mask if unable to distance yourself, as in a store etc.

[BradG]

14 hours ago, Winnie said:

BradG, the problem is you can be a carrier with no symptoms, hence, wear a mask if unable to distance yourself, as in a store etc.

The World Health Organisations admits that there is actually no data on transmission from asymptomatic carriers. However, think about things logically, if you're not coughing or sneezing, you're not really putting out infectious droplets into the air around you, then it is unlikely you will infect people around you in a shop. 

Having said that I will be wearing a mask, only because it is a $200 dollar fine if you don't and I believe in giving the government as little money of yours that you can. However I'm not under any illusion that some thin piece of cloth is going to give me immunity from catching anything.

[Jeff]

They asked folks here in B.C. to keep following the 'rules', and be careful over the summer months, and we can keep this sort of at bay, BUT a couple weekends ago, some young party goers threw everything out the window, and rocked on, with very large groups etc, and now we have a HUGE spike in cases, and the 'officials' are quite worried and it sounds as though new plans are a foot..... for more regulations................ thanks kids, I hope it was worth it......

[TonyWills]

5 hours ago, BradG said:

The World Health Organisations admits that there is actually no data on transmission from asymptomatic carriers. However, think about things logically, if you're not coughing or sneezing, you're not really putting out infectious droplets into the air around you, then it is unlikely you will infect people around you in a shop. 

Having said that I will be wearing a mask, only because it is a $200 dollar fine if you don't and I believe in giving the government as little money of yours that you can. However I'm not under any illusion that some thin piece of cloth is going to give me immunity from catching anything.

Unfortunately, whilst asymptomatic carriers are not coughing or sneezing, they are breathing, talking, shouting, running, etc. The viral cloud from simply speaking projects beyond six feet and remains airborne for around 30 minutes. This is smaller droplets, with the larger droplets that are assumed to carry the virus not getting beyond six feet. Work is ongoing as to whether those smaller droplets also carry the virus. Shouting increases this, as does breathing heavily following exercise or manual labor. The asymptomatic carrier also opens doors, pushes shopping carts, touches goods, all of which are known to transfer the virus. An asymptomatic jogger can leave a trail 30 feet long, leaving the 6 feet rule of little help, but if they wore a mask, that trail would be very significantly less.

To me, logically, most people catch coronavirus from presymptomatic and asymptomatic carriers, because most people are careful to wash hands, and quickly avoid people with coughs or sneezes, but the disease still manages to transfer from 1 carrier to between 2-3 others on average. The majority of people who have caught the disease have no idea how they caught it, which suggests asymptomatic transfer must be fairly high, as they avoid obviously ill people but still catch it.

Whilst the science behind this is still developing, I'm assuming the worst. I wear a mask whenever I go out, despite most people looking at me like I'm an alien. I find mask wearing a little inconvenient, but that's all. Of course, mask wearing is known to protect those around you. Look at Asia, were mask wearing is second nature, and the figures are far, far lower than most everywhere else. Mask wearing works, but it works far, far better when everybody wears a mask. Consider the two mask-wearing hairstylists in Missouri, both of whom tested positive. But as they both wore masks, as did their clients, none of their 120 odd clients caught the virus. Not a single one.

You may catch the virus from a non-mask wearing asymptomatic carrier, because they chose not to wear a mask. You can then infect other people because you don't wear a mask, and that carries on until an elderly or compromised person catches the virus and dies, to say nothing of other people who survive but are hospitalized and gravely ill. That's why 140,000+ people are dead in the US and the economy is in tatters, whilst the likes of China, Japan, Vietnam & South Korea lost relatively few people and have economies far more open than ours. The aversion to masks has killed thousands of Americans, and continues to do so.

I just don't get it.

 

 

[BradG]

Sorry, but you are being alarmist and leaving out a lot of "maybe" "could" "might" and "possibly" from your assertions regarding the virus. I am still not going to rely on a piece of fabric to protect me, as I said, only wearing one so I don't get fined, but under no illusion that it's some type of defence. Besides which, say you're correct and the virus is airbourne for a long time, it's going to be small enough to penetrate the fabric of a cloth mask.

[TonyWills]

1 hour ago, BradG said:

Sorry, but you are being alarmist and leaving out a lot of "maybe" "could" "might" and "possibly" from your assertions regarding the virus. I am still not going to rely on a piece of fabric to protect me, as I said, only wearing one so I don't get fined, but under no illusion that it's some type of defence. Besides which, say you're correct and the virus is airbourne for a long time, it's going to be small enough to penetrate the fabric of a cloth mask.

The mask doesn't primarily protect you, it protects others from you. Other people wear one to protect you from them. That way, everybody stays well. That's why Asian countries that wear masks have far, far lower deaths and infections. That's a verifiable fact. Not maybe, or could, or might, or possibly. Just look at the figures. 

But you are not ill, so don't need a mask? Well, you could conceivably have the virus. It's estimated up to 40% of cases are asymptomatic. Are you not interested in protecting other people? Making sure the economy doesn't have to shut down again, which is in everyone's interest? Helping people keep their jobs? Stop people from dying?

As for being "alarmist", there are in excess of 140,000 dead Americans. In five months. With total deaths expected to push 240,000 by November, and over 300,000 sometime next year. These are actual, scientific forecasts, from the same people that, back in March, forecast death of around 150,000 by the end of July. Each death, on average, robbed the victim of 11 years of remaining life.

I do actually find it "alarming".

[BradG]

It might, but if you're sick you should be at home. As I pointed out, if you're not sneezing or coughing etc, it's going to be difficult to transmit any virus. However, if I believe you and someone running can leave a 30 meter spread of this virus behind them floating in the air, then a mask isn't going to do me any good, a virus is small enough to pass right through it. So on one hand you argue that masks protect others, but then if you believe what you wrote about the virus being air borne, it makes wearing your mask virtually useless. Which is it?

Yes, people are dying, numbers sound scary, but I can do that too. On average, 2-3 thousand people world wide died per day of this virus. 7 thousand per day died in that time of other lower respiratory diseases, diarrheal diseases over 4 thousand per day (major killer of children under 5), 5 thousand per day died of neonatal disorders, 3500 per day of TD, 3 thousand of Aids. These are just the communicable reasons. 50,000 people will die to day due to cardiovascular issues, 30,000 from cancer...on and on and on.

[HubertB]

This is old (published end of April), but probably worth reposting here as an illustration :

Hubert

[[CAT]CplSlade]

In October 1918, the Spanish Flu killed approximately 195,000 Americans. Just to give some perspective.

[Drdave]

That’s a different pandemic. Different time. No ICU, no medical oxygen, no antibiotics, no antigen testing. Apples and pears really.

[[CAT]CplSlade]

1 hour ago, Drdave said:

That’s a different pandemic. Different time.

Is it really? I had no clue.

[Drdave]

Covid is an awful And terrifying disease up close. We admitted 60 odd patients through the ICU during our surge. Initial mortality was 75% and overall was 45% in the UK by the end of the surge. Some patients spent 60 plus days ventilated. We were lucky that we never ran out of ICU beds.I had no leave from Mid February until this week. It was bloody awful, not having visitors in until end of life and having to break the worst news over the phone. The PPE is exhausting, draining.
I have every sympathy for anyone in any country going through a Covid surge. I just hope we don’t see a second wave in the UK, alas I am not optimistic. Most epidemiological modelling is suggesting a second surge of 100,000 further deaths by next spring.

Tubby, middle aged slightly co morbid men are at greater risk too. Although the overall mortality sounds low at 2%, if you end up on oxygen you are staring at a 30% mortality rate. If you need ICU ventilation 45% and 75% if you develop renal failure, as a significant proportion do.
 

[Wumm]

On 7/22/2020 at 1:13 AM, TonyWills said:

The aversion to masks has killed thousands of Americans, and continues to do so.

I just don't get it.

We have replaced common sense with Civil liberties. 

A photo from Regional Queensland of a quarantine Station during the 1919 Spanish Flu Pandemic...

A Century later, we have the enlightened Masses complaining because they can't play Golf or go to their favourite Café for a latte. Refusing to social distance or wear a mask when requested to. Crying foul because they're not allowed out of their four-star Hotel for a cigarette during quarantine, or worse still; bribing guards to let them out for a spot of shopping. And the epitome of Idiosy... 90% of people reporting as sick continuing to work and go about their business instead of isolating themselves.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-07-22/coronavirus-australia-live-news-covid-19-latest-victoria/12478472

As a Nation, we had this suppressed. Then Victoria loused it up for everyone, and now we're back to square one. Let that be a lesson for everyone.

[BradG]

Well, not all Victorians, the screw up was the hotel quarantine which they think almost all cases can be traced back to now. 

[GazzaS]

Well...once Covid surpasses Spanish flu, maybe people will take it more seriously.  Social media doesn't help.  But then again, the country falling to bits because everything is closed isn't a viable answer either.  The fact that you can re-catch it makes it even more scary.

 

The message from mother nature is clear:  "It's taken a long time for me to come up with a better way...  but I'm coming for you!"