Daft project or is it? 1/32 Short Stirling III

[Peterpools]

Cees

Terrific start on the throttle quadrant and some excellent research pi’s.

Keep ‘em comin

Peter

[Maybach_Man]

Brilliant progress... Is there a page to follow the renovation of the full size one?

[Wingco57]

Yes, google Stirling Project and all will be revealed.

Not much time for modelling the past few days, but did get some today. And a destructive session it was.

Although fun these kits have one major flaw and that is that  the fuselage nosesection in planview is not tapered.
 

So the Modeller has two options. Leave it like it is and have a plank instead of a good representation, or (you guessed it) modify the fuselage halves. Which I did. The pic of the crashed Stirling shows that the top of the nose is tapered and the bottom is much wider, a bit eggshaped.

So the top needed quite some material removed (outlined in pencil). After some hacking the shape begins to emerge.
The front edge needs to be a half circle so not there yet. 
 

Problem is the the bulkhead is now  too wide at the top do the halves cannot be closed. That is for the next hacking session.

[Kaireckstadt]

2 hours ago, Wingco57 said:

Yes, google Stirling Project and all will be revealed.

Not much time for modelling the past few days, but did get some today. And a destructive session it was.

Although fun these kits have one major flaw and that is that  the fuselage nosesection in planview is not tapered.
 

So the Modeller has two options. Leave it like it is and have a plank instead of a good representation, or (you guessed it) modify the fuselage halves. Which I did. The pic of the crashed Stirling shows that the top of the nose is tapered and the bottom is much wider, a bit eggshaped.

So the top needed quite some material removed (outlined in pencil). After some hacking the shape begins to emerge.
The front edge needs to be a half circle so not there yet. 
 

Problem is the the bulkhead is now  too wide at the top do the halves cannot be closed. That is for the next hacking session.

That’s not an easy job you have to do but taking into account the skills you have you will easily manage.

I wouldn’t have expected anything else from you than facing the challenge. 

Looking forward to seeing the progress!

[CrankyCrafstman]

Keep em coming 

[Wingco57]

Thanks, surgery has been done and I am   
happy about the top section. The area between the bombardier and the noseturret will be difficult however as the plastic doesn’t follow the intended lines. These need to be a combination of a triangle and circle. Perhaps I will have to follow Megas Tsonos’ build in this.

Been looking at the noseturret itself too. I have a HK Models FN5 of which the interior is similar to the Stirling setup. The sides however are much flatter and have no framing. Squeezing the transparency may work as you can see the difference in the pics. I will have to modify the baseplate too by cutting off the triangular sides.

dryfitting the turret in the nosesection shows that a lot of work is still needed.
But thinking how to solve problems is part of the fun too.

[Peterpools]

 Cees

Nice work on the survey - just what the doctor ordered.The. Nose turret surely has all sorts of issues and can’t wait to see how you solve the issue.My money is riding on you

Keep ‘em comin

Peter

[Wingco57]

Due to lack of suitably enlarged drawings I cannot continue the nose butchery at the moment.

So I thought why not free the major parts from the backing plastic. As you can see the surface is quite rough here  and there. Cutting out the parts is a very straightforward job and after 20 minutes I had a general idea of the size of the beast. 
 

This sure is a big b........bugger. I let the pics do the talking.

[Kaireckstadt]

5 minutes ago, Wingco57 said:

Due to lack of suitably enlarged drawings I cannot continue the nose butchery at the moment.

So I thought why not free the major parts from the backing plastic. As you can see the surface is quite rough here  and there. Cutting out the parts is a very straightforward job and after 20 minutes I had a general idea of the size of the beast. 
 

This sure is a big b........bugger. I let the pics do the talking.

Great progress! And lots of work ahead of you! It’s more than huge!! Will you add a metal wing spar ? 
Where will you store that big b...?

[Peterpools]

Cees

Nice progress on cutting out the HUGE wings and completely agree, she is one BIG Gal!

Thing the same as Kai, I'm sure you have an idea how you want to add a reinforcing spar for those large wings and to carry the weight from wing tip to wing tip.

Keep 'em comin

Peter

[GusMac]

I'm sure there's guys from our local gliding club who go up in smaller things than that! 

[GazzaS]

That is big!  But more worrying is the 'puffiness' in the moldings.

[DocRob]

I admire your willingness and bravery to master this kit. Seeing the surfaces would scare me to the core, without an idea to get them look interesting and right in the end. 

Cheer Rob

[Wingco57]

Thanks, I hope the puffiness will disappear after sanding.

 I have practiced a lot on the Manchester (HK Models 3d printed prototype devoid of any detail) so this blank canvas will be similar.

Problem is that the Warpaint drawings do not match the kit which makes marking out the panellines in pencil a hit and miss affair. I do have another set from a different source which may help. Only after I am satisfied I will engrave the panellines.
 

But I have cut out the flap area. Looking at the superb scratchbuild model by Megas Tsonos the Stirling will look great with those massive Gouge flaps lowered.

[HubertB]

21 hours ago, GazzaS said:

That is big!  But more worrying is the 'puffiness' in the moldings.

This is why vac-forms get such a poor reputation. There are two ways to produce a vac-form: pulling the sheet on a male plug, or drawing it into a female plug. 
The female mold method produces sharply-defined, with good surface detail, shapes, and the separation line from the backing sheet is clearly defined as well. My Nieuport Sesquiplan was produced this way, as were the Welsh Models 1/144 liners. 
 

But of course, this requires a lot more work for the producer than the male plug method: making a master, then producing molds for the female vacforming process, with suitably placed micro-holes for the suction to work.

Which is why, most of the time, vacs are made with the male master plug method. Easy-peezy, lazy way.

Add to that the approximate shapes that ID Models were used to (in my own experience, I had to throw away the Saab J-29 kit, and the HP Hampden is not much better, with too shallow fuselage, very wrong engine cowlings - lacking a good 4+ mm in diameter - and inaccurate transparencies), and you end up with blobs of plastic with a huge potential only for the bravest - or foolest - modellers like our friend Wingco  ...

Hubert

[Wingco57]

True, The Hampden is one of my pet projects but after failing twice using the vacforms I gave up. The only other option would be to make the moulds myself . I did scratchbuild a complete Hampden tail from solid plasticard  once. Did the same for a Whitley

  I said before ( apart from inaccuracies) the fuselage on the original ID Models do not taper at the nose and tail giving a plank-like view which is not accurate. The builder needs to do a lot of work to obtain anything resembling the real aircraft. I have a lot of fun hacking away at these kits to get a better understanding of the aircraft.

Today I have removed the aileron halves and the massive flap to get an idea of the basic wingstructure.

 

[Bomber_County]

You are a braver man than I, stunning scratch building.....

[Peterpools]

Cees

Your progress is amazing and a pleasure to follow

Keep 'em comin

Peter

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[Peterpools]

Hubert

Tank you for the information - always an extra bonus to keep learning something new with each build

Peter

 

[Wingco57]

Thanks, work continues with cutting out the tailparts. Then I concentrated on the wings. I temporarily stopped working on the cockpit due to the lack of proper sized drawings. I think a trip to the office is needed although working from home since March 2020.

in the meantime I have cut away the wingroots as the profile is incorrect. Being too flat, it should curve at the top and flat at the bottom. Also adjusted the flap separating line as they are not symmetrical (tip, never trust anything but check). Also the wings are very flexible now and really need some strong spars. Next time marking out the panellines and hopefully followed by some scribing.

[harv]

Love watching your work !....harv

[ThomasProbert]

Another great update, Cees!

Will the reshaping of the wing profile effect the angle of the engines and thrust line at all?

Tom

[Kaireckstadt]

2 hours ago, Wingco57 said:

Thanks, work continues with cutting out the tailparts. Then I concentrated on the wings. I temporarily stopped working on the cockpit due to the lack of proper sized drawings. I think a trip to the office is needed although working from home since March 2020.

in the meantime I have cut away the wingroots as the profile is incorrect. Being too flat, it should curve at the top and flat at the bottom. Also adjusted the flap separating line as they are not symmetrical (tip, never trust anything but check). Also the wings are very flexible now and really need some strong spars. Next time marking out the panellines and hopefully followed by some scribing.

Great progress on a more than challenging subject! I‘m gluing parts together and you create them! Awesome work Cees! 

[Peterpools]

Ceese

Awesome progress on the wings. The pic with you holding the wing panel drove home how BIG the kit actually is.

Keep 'em comin

Peter

[Wingco57]

On 4/8/2021 at 12:13 PM, ThomasProbert said:

Another great update, Cees!

Will the reshaping of the wing profile effect the angle of the engines and thrust line at all?

Tom

Hi Tom,

Hope not, the plan is to keep everything forward of the frontspar intact and bend the surface aft of it. The kit wing crosssection is wrong as the undersurface of the Stirling was nearly flat. That was the reason for cutting away the wingroots as originally moulded. The nacelles need to keep their correct position relative to the fuselage.

Been a while due to the lack of upscaled drawings, guesstimating is not an option so I continued by cutting out the starboard undersurface flap and aileron. These parts sure are flimsy and sturdy wingspars will be a necessary luxury. Took these pics with the iPad due to the size of the wingparts.